While I totally understand the dog pile on the DNC for the Xeet about Asa Hutchinson, let me point out this is yet ANOTHER example of asymetry, and I hate it. The DNC doesn't get to have fun without the scolds coming out of the woodwork, but the ... checks notes... current front runner for the Republican Nomination and former presidents …
While I totally understand the dog pile on the DNC for the Xeet about Asa Hutchinson, let me point out this is yet ANOTHER example of asymetry, and I hate it. The DNC doesn't get to have fun without the scolds coming out of the woodwork, but the ... checks notes... current front runner for the Republican Nomination and former presidents calls us animals and pedophiles and says we're poisoning the blood of the country, and we collectively shrug. Please allow me to wave my giant bullshit flag.
"While I totally understand the dog pile on the DNC for the Xeet about Asa Hutchinson, let me point out this is yet ANOTHER example of asymetry, and I hate it. The DNC doesn't get to have fun without the scolds coming out of the woodwork, but the ... checks notes... current front runner for the Republican Nomination and former presidents calls us animals and pedophiles and says we're poisoning the blood of the country, and we collectively shrug. Please allow me to wave my giant bullshit flag."
That's because the cycle, including in the media, has devolved into "that's just Donald being Donald" on one side and Biden having to play by the rules as an old-order guy on the other. Trump supporters are similarly liberated to talk and act as they like while liberals are held to a measuring stick of "if you say you're against it, you need to act like it." The double standard is obvious, but not enough people care about it to hit a reset button on it, or at least insist on setting the bar equally high in both directions.
Sure, and I definitely get this. Tell me: what is the antidote. This is going to happen 1 million more times between now and November. We should collectively have a strategy.
That's the rub. There doesn't seem to be a solution to the problem -- it is baked-in by now, at least with regard to the acceptance of Donald behaving however he likes, with no consequences, because rightly or wrongly (eye of the beholder) it is seen as a successful model. I fully agree with your perspective and feel similarly discouraged that there are two sets of rules on how each side is expected to behave. My own efforts are geared toward being a positive, uplifting presence, countering errors and hyperbole with facts, and hoping that the rising tide eventually will float all boats, even those currently willing to sink. Ideally there is strength in numbers if we can maintain a united front -- easier said then done when the temptation to lash out is so great.
The grassroots active Democrats in my district--the ones who fundraise, canvass, register voters, and volunteer at the polls--have little love for the DNC or the DCCC. Our House candidates can't even get into the room with those folks if they haven't already raised at least a million dollars (and even then the door usually stays closed). The national party has forgotten what it's like to fight for every single vote.
Look, this obviously a great point, and I have no argument, and nearly everytime I have a conversation with the moderate or a Democrat, I get this same vibe. I'm merely pointing out that the asymetry is terrible and terrible for our republic.
I propose a new construct, "When they go low, we kick them." ;) (Mostly, just kidding).
Agree with you totally about the asymetry problem, John; we need to call it out whenever we see it. (The new construct works for me, too. Kick 'em clean, without the snark, so they can't punch back.)
This is whataboutism and it's not even good whataboutism. People do slam the Republicans for their lies and slander. That doesn't mean the DNC's poop can't stink.
No, this isn't whataboutism. I genuinely don't understand why one side in our debates gets to make these vile accusations and takes all day, and collectively, we shrug. Xitter is full of terrible takes; sure, plenty of people slam Republicans, and it has no impact. This is about the idealogical receptiveness of the electorate. Bill Kristol, Charlie, and JVL are obviously right, this IS poor messaging, only because the broader Democratic coalition doesn't want to hear this kind of messaging. But it is an undeniable fact that much of the MAGA base LIVES for this kind of dialogue.
In the before times this would have just been a normal partisan tweet. When party membership is at its most fluid because one party is no longer normal it's not a time for playing games but for encouraging people to break out of their comfort zones. This message sends the opposite message and I think it's good to be called out.
It's true, the GOP mocking POWs is all good clean fun. A single snarky DNC tweet (or whatever it's called) about a public figure is a reason to never vote Democratic again. The Democrats should have been more careful!
Well...for me...it wasn't necessarily the comment but who the comment targeted...a non-MAGA potential ally. That's where I don't think the snarky-ness was worth it.
"Trump is out here promising to lock up his enemies and close the borders, but let's all grab a fainting couch because the DNC sent out a snarky press release.
Fasten your seat belts, boys. It's going to be a bumpy ride."
Like I said in another comment...if this was a DNC tweet for Ron DeSantis dropping out of the race...you won't hear a peep out of me. To do it on a GOP guy calling out his own party???? That's not smart politics....and definitely not a cheap shot that I endorse.
Considering that Trump is the frontrunner for the GOP...I think he's doing both....at great political cost. That's not who we should be targeting if we really want to win.
Hey, there s political life after 73 - even if there shouldn't be. I'm a boomer and I'd be the first to say boomers should be stepping aside and leaving a warm space for someone younger. The world needs supportive elders right now, not worn and weary boomers hanging on with grim determination. And that's not just in politics.
Sure, Asa can show up at the campaign events or get hired as "board member" to one of the Wingnut Welfare Academies or just go fishing for the rest of his life. He's made his mark, for good or bad.
And I'd like to add, there is great institutional knowledge among us elders and they have a lot to pass on to the new generations, so it's not really an age thing with me.
I think the other thing that bugged me is the lack of imagination and the laziness of the post. They could have done something like "Thank you to Governor Hutchinson who attempted to speak the truth at the GOP debates. Perhaps a change of political venue is in order to a party where the truth is valued and upheld"
I'm sure others could say it better, but I think this sort of response would have kept things at a higher level rather than go down to the MAGA one.
Well....I'm thinking he could have just gone away quietly like 99% of the rest of the GOP. I'm sure he's going to see his political circle shrink and it probably already has.
Again...my point is why attack someone who is supporting the effort to keep Trump out of office and is telling the truth about him?
While I totally understand the dog pile on the DNC for the Xeet about Asa Hutchinson, let me point out this is yet ANOTHER example of asymetry, and I hate it. The DNC doesn't get to have fun without the scolds coming out of the woodwork, but the ... checks notes... current front runner for the Republican Nomination and former presidents calls us animals and pedophiles and says we're poisoning the blood of the country, and we collectively shrug. Please allow me to wave my giant bullshit flag.
"While I totally understand the dog pile on the DNC for the Xeet about Asa Hutchinson, let me point out this is yet ANOTHER example of asymetry, and I hate it. The DNC doesn't get to have fun without the scolds coming out of the woodwork, but the ... checks notes... current front runner for the Republican Nomination and former presidents calls us animals and pedophiles and says we're poisoning the blood of the country, and we collectively shrug. Please allow me to wave my giant bullshit flag."
In short: FUCK 'EM!
That's because the cycle, including in the media, has devolved into "that's just Donald being Donald" on one side and Biden having to play by the rules as an old-order guy on the other. Trump supporters are similarly liberated to talk and act as they like while liberals are held to a measuring stick of "if you say you're against it, you need to act like it." The double standard is obvious, but not enough people care about it to hit a reset button on it, or at least insist on setting the bar equally high in both directions.
Sure, and I definitely get this. Tell me: what is the antidote. This is going to happen 1 million more times between now and November. We should collectively have a strategy.
That's the rub. There doesn't seem to be a solution to the problem -- it is baked-in by now, at least with regard to the acceptance of Donald behaving however he likes, with no consequences, because rightly or wrongly (eye of the beholder) it is seen as a successful model. I fully agree with your perspective and feel similarly discouraged that there are two sets of rules on how each side is expected to behave. My own efforts are geared toward being a positive, uplifting presence, countering errors and hyperbole with facts, and hoping that the rising tide eventually will float all boats, even those currently willing to sink. Ideally there is strength in numbers if we can maintain a united front -- easier said then done when the temptation to lash out is so great.
This is a really good comment. I agree.
What happened to "when they go low, we go high"?
The grassroots active Democrats in my district--the ones who fundraise, canvass, register voters, and volunteer at the polls--have little love for the DNC or the DCCC. Our House candidates can't even get into the room with those folks if they haven't already raised at least a million dollars (and even then the door usually stays closed). The national party has forgotten what it's like to fight for every single vote.
Look, this obviously a great point, and I have no argument, and nearly everytime I have a conversation with the moderate or a Democrat, I get this same vibe. I'm merely pointing out that the asymetry is terrible and terrible for our republic.
I propose a new construct, "When they go low, we kick them." ;) (Mostly, just kidding).
Agree with you totally about the asymetry problem, John; we need to call it out whenever we see it. (The new construct works for me, too. Kick 'em clean, without the snark, so they can't punch back.)
This is whataboutism and it's not even good whataboutism. People do slam the Republicans for their lies and slander. That doesn't mean the DNC's poop can't stink.
No, this isn't whataboutism. I genuinely don't understand why one side in our debates gets to make these vile accusations and takes all day, and collectively, we shrug. Xitter is full of terrible takes; sure, plenty of people slam Republicans, and it has no impact. This is about the idealogical receptiveness of the electorate. Bill Kristol, Charlie, and JVL are obviously right, this IS poor messaging, only because the broader Democratic coalition doesn't want to hear this kind of messaging. But it is an undeniable fact that much of the MAGA base LIVES for this kind of dialogue.
Perhaps I misunderstood. I apologize.
In the before times this would have just been a normal partisan tweet. When party membership is at its most fluid because one party is no longer normal it's not a time for playing games but for encouraging people to break out of their comfort zones. This message sends the opposite message and I think it's good to be called out.
The amount of consternation from the civility police when Democrats act out of sorts is absolutely noticeable.
It's true, the GOP mocking POWs is all good clean fun. A single snarky DNC tweet (or whatever it's called) about a public figure is a reason to never vote Democratic again. The Democrats should have been more careful!
Well...for me...it wasn't necessarily the comment but who the comment targeted...a non-MAGA potential ally. That's where I don't think the snarky-ness was worth it.
With the stakes of the election outcome being so high, I am willing to suck it up now. But agree life ain’t fair.
Yes, but I'm still gonna fly the flag.
My thoughts exactly! My tweet yesterday:
"Trump is out here promising to lock up his enemies and close the borders, but let's all grab a fainting couch because the DNC sent out a snarky press release.
Fasten your seat belts, boys. It's going to be a bumpy ride."
(obligatory Bette Davis GIF at the end there).
https://x.com/skohayes/status/1747479395336393047?s=20
Like I said in another comment...if this was a DNC tweet for Ron DeSantis dropping out of the race...you won't hear a peep out of me. To do it on a GOP guy calling out his own party???? That's not smart politics....and definitely not a cheap shot that I endorse.
He never called out the party that I ever heard, although he had plenty to say about Trump.
Considering that Trump is the frontrunner for the GOP...I think he's doing both....at great political cost. That's not who we should be targeting if we really want to win.
What great political cost? He was term limited as governor, and he's 73.
Hey, there s political life after 73 - even if there shouldn't be. I'm a boomer and I'd be the first to say boomers should be stepping aside and leaving a warm space for someone younger. The world needs supportive elders right now, not worn and weary boomers hanging on with grim determination. And that's not just in politics.
Hello fellow boomer!
Sure, Asa can show up at the campaign events or get hired as "board member" to one of the Wingnut Welfare Academies or just go fishing for the rest of his life. He's made his mark, for good or bad.
And I'd like to add, there is great institutional knowledge among us elders and they have a lot to pass on to the new generations, so it's not really an age thing with me.
I think the other thing that bugged me is the lack of imagination and the laziness of the post. They could have done something like "Thank you to Governor Hutchinson who attempted to speak the truth at the GOP debates. Perhaps a change of political venue is in order to a party where the truth is valued and upheld"
I'm sure others could say it better, but I think this sort of response would have kept things at a higher level rather than go down to the MAGA one.
Well....I'm thinking he could have just gone away quietly like 99% of the rest of the GOP. I'm sure he's going to see his political circle shrink and it probably already has.
Again...my point is why attack someone who is supporting the effort to keep Trump out of office and is telling the truth about him?