I am a veteran and was an avid target shooter. I grew disgusted with the gun-porn and thinly veiled racism of the NRA and did not renew my membership (which effectively banned me from competitive shooting). I was kept on the NRA’s membership roll for years. Also, whose family thinks to tell the NRA of a life member’s death? My point is that the NRA membership is almost certainly a fraction of what they claim.
What’s left is being a lobbyist for the gun manufacturers.
The right wing media loves to use Chicago as its boogeyman. Let’s think about it. The criminals in Chicago aren’t using pistols they found in grandpa’s old Army footlocker, they have the latest gear available in endless supply. How?
Straw sales.
In most red states, you can buy a box of Glocks with nothing more than your drivers license. You can then sell them without a background check in a private transaction. To a gangster gun wholesaler.
It’s more than $1bbn/year in sales to criminals with zero repercussions. This is the NRA’s real business interest.
There’s a simple answer. Make manufacturers criminally responsible for the sale channels. This and universal background checks for all used gun sales would dry up straw sales overnight.
Another supply is legally bought guns that are stolen each year fully insured loses for the gun owner and no penalty for the person caught in possession of the stolen gun except loss of the gun. If you are driving around a stolen car you go to jail, but a gun in most cases you walk free.
While state laws differ regarding penalties for gun theft, it is generally considered a serious crime. In many states, stealing a gun constitutes a grand theft, which is a felony regardless of the offender's criminal background or value of the gun. Apparently there is not enough deterrent, and maybe gun theft should be a federal felony. https://www.americanprogress.org/article/gun-theft-united-states-state-state-analysis/
Gun theft is a crime and knowingly receiving stolen property is a crime. You must prove either one of those, mere possession isn't proof nor criminal in most states. BTW, I read links. No matter the title that was not a state by state analysis, just an advocacy piece with a couple of tables. Further it didn't seem address your comment anywhere I could see. Maybe it wasn;t the link to the article intended.
Love this:"There’s a simple answer. Make manufacturers criminally responsible for the sale channels. This and universal background checks for all used gun sales would dry up straw sales overnight." This is about money, it's ALWAYS about money. And greed is one of the deadly sins, in more ways than one.
It's not even close to a perfect answer though. Guns change hands several times between initial sale and where they end up. Most guns in Mexico are from illegal gun transactions in the US.
I read comments like yours all the time in many venues, regarding being gun owners and members of the NRA, yet supporting common sense gun regulation, education, and registration. I was going to ask what keeps all of you paying dues to the NRA, because it would seem that if all of you stopped, it would create a financial impact that they couldn't outright ignore.
But clearly either you don't pay dues or it's nominal and would have no impact on them.
I wonder now if more high-profile people from the Republican party would write letters such as George H. W. Bush did, and make them public, that it might have some impact?
Bottom line, though, is voters need to make it a real priority to vote out those who do nothing but offer "thoughts and prayers", and vote in those who are willing to take on the NRA.
First, most gun owners aren't members of the NRA. But as the commenter pointed out a good many recreational activities, also, gun safety training certifications are done through the NRA.. It is a bit like a college football player not wanting to affiliate with the NCAA. They are the only game in town.
"But as the commenter pointed out a good many recreational activities, also, gun safety training certifications are done through the NRA.. It is a bit like a college football player not wanting to affiliate with the NCAA. They are the only game in town."
Not to mention that a lot of shooting ranges get their insurance through the NRA, and require their range members to be NRA members in order to stay eligible for the insurance.
My husband used to belong to a pistol club where he was in a target shooting league. A prerequisite to membership was a current membership to the NRA because at one time, they provided legal representation to the club for some lawsuit. He no longer belongs because of this requirement.
Amazing isn't? We have people like Tucker, Hannity, Dreher, etc. praising Putin and Orban, etc. completely ignoring the fact that those wonderful people have restrictions that RW are/would be screaming about if they were here.
Cue a whole bunch of people promoting a vice. Great. I agree with legalizing pot because we shoulda learned our lesson with prohibition, but like the alcohol it is often compared to, it is still a vice.
Sure it is. That is why its defenders always say it's no worse than alcohol. Fact is, it does not belong in the human body any more than tobacco or alcohol does. The body must process it as a poison, not as a nutrient.
The Netherlands has not "legalized" but has decriminalized drugs. They have what they call a "social support system" to provide treatment for drug users.
Yes, but not all criminal enterprises are equal. Drugs are easy to supply and in high demand. That tends to create more suppliers and grow a large criminal industry. Those other crimes you mentioned are much higher risk and more difficult to sustain and supply. It's the reason that Prohibition resulted in a huge spike in organized crime.
They are just finding and supplying a market demand. The war on drugs (and other vices) is simply a profit center for the law enforcement/prison industrial complex.
Years ago I read an analysis about the entrepreneurial skills most criminals possess. In the non-criminal world they could be successful. But they like the buzz of that frisson of risk.
Actually they are socially and economically not positioned to enter the non-criminal entrepreneurial world. They adapt themselves to their environment as a survival strategy.
I was thinking more that they share the same entrepreneurial skill set. But I do know some shady characters who are attracted to the excitement of the underworld.
Yes. Along with legalizing prostitution. Let’s be honest; a lot of these mass shooters are sexually frustrated, socially awkward young men awash in overwhelming and erratic male hormones.
Some would say that if prostitution is legal, well paid and regulated, it’s not exploitation. I’m just tossing out a little hand grenade here. Stopping “boys will be boys” seems like a more impossible dream than allowing cooling their jets.
It's exploitation because it objectifies humans by making them into commodities. Besides, do you really believe that a good fuck is all a mass shooter needs for their murderous impulses to stop?
I make the case that those statistics are supportive of my solution, rather than undercutting it. They have issues with females that might be assuaged. However, recent mass shootings seem to be unattached young males.
Sorry ladies, but for the good of the country I need to propose we adopt a "Fuck an Incel" week. Think of the lives saved. But it is up to women, once again, to fix the mess we men made. /s
Fuck that. Those incels have hands they should make better use of them than pulling triggers. Those misogynist MFers should maybe stop being hateful violent domestic terrorists.
Most of the time, a black market is what raises prices. It constricts the supply. The prices for legal weed should be considerably lower than when it was illegal - otherwise, why not get it from local growers, or grow your own? Has your state actually legalized weed altogether (production, sale, and possession) or just decriminalized possession? It sounds like the supply is over-regulated and over-constricted. Drug companies can't just decide to raise prices if the market is allowed to function.
Because up until recently it has been illegal (and at the Federal level it still is). That's all that matters from the point of discussing black markets and pricing.
This is why I grow my own homie. Better quality than the dispos and a fraction of the price. Shiiiid in Denver I can buy clones at Kind Love. Don't even gotta shop for seed on the black market.
Travis, here in Illinois clones aren't available, but I get my seeds from reputable seed houses, not the black market. There are several (not naming them here; don't want to aggravate Charlie) that I buy from regularly and a couple offer free shipping. Happy growing, dear.
I've worked in the industry and have access to prime cuts (and good fem/auto seeds). Was just offering it up as an example. Said seed houses are what I was referring to and I know of several good ones ;-)
The tax revenue from the drugs could be earmarked for treatment. Also, some people will use drugs like MDMA and cocaine recreationally (as they currently do). I suspect we'd have less overdoses and deaths as well because the supply would be uniform and regulated
No, because there will always be someone selling below the market. There will also be bootleg pharmaceuticals - oxycodone, fentanyl, xanax et al - that are smuggled into the US by China. Those drugs will never be authorized for recreational use, and shouldn't be.
I am a veteran and was an avid target shooter. I grew disgusted with the gun-porn and thinly veiled racism of the NRA and did not renew my membership (which effectively banned me from competitive shooting). I was kept on the NRA’s membership roll for years. Also, whose family thinks to tell the NRA of a life member’s death? My point is that the NRA membership is almost certainly a fraction of what they claim.
What’s left is being a lobbyist for the gun manufacturers.
The right wing media loves to use Chicago as its boogeyman. Let’s think about it. The criminals in Chicago aren’t using pistols they found in grandpa’s old Army footlocker, they have the latest gear available in endless supply. How?
Straw sales.
In most red states, you can buy a box of Glocks with nothing more than your drivers license. You can then sell them without a background check in a private transaction. To a gangster gun wholesaler.
It’s more than $1bbn/year in sales to criminals with zero repercussions. This is the NRA’s real business interest.
There’s a simple answer. Make manufacturers criminally responsible for the sale channels. This and universal background checks for all used gun sales would dry up straw sales overnight.
Another supply is legally bought guns that are stolen each year fully insured loses for the gun owner and no penalty for the person caught in possession of the stolen gun except loss of the gun. If you are driving around a stolen car you go to jail, but a gun in most cases you walk free.
While state laws differ regarding penalties for gun theft, it is generally considered a serious crime. In many states, stealing a gun constitutes a grand theft, which is a felony regardless of the offender's criminal background or value of the gun. Apparently there is not enough deterrent, and maybe gun theft should be a federal felony. https://www.americanprogress.org/article/gun-theft-united-states-state-state-analysis/
Gun theft is a crime and knowingly receiving stolen property is a crime. You must prove either one of those, mere possession isn't proof nor criminal in most states. BTW, I read links. No matter the title that was not a state by state analysis, just an advocacy piece with a couple of tables. Further it didn't seem address your comment anywhere I could see. Maybe it wasn;t the link to the article intended.
But clicking on it did get me gun control ads from google ads.
absolutely true...once you understand that the NRA's main function is selling guns, it all makes perfect sense
Love this:"There’s a simple answer. Make manufacturers criminally responsible for the sale channels. This and universal background checks for all used gun sales would dry up straw sales overnight." This is about money, it's ALWAYS about money. And greed is one of the deadly sins, in more ways than one.
It's not even close to a perfect answer though. Guns change hands several times between initial sale and where they end up. Most guns in Mexico are from illegal gun transactions in the US.
I read comments like yours all the time in many venues, regarding being gun owners and members of the NRA, yet supporting common sense gun regulation, education, and registration. I was going to ask what keeps all of you paying dues to the NRA, because it would seem that if all of you stopped, it would create a financial impact that they couldn't outright ignore.
But clearly either you don't pay dues or it's nominal and would have no impact on them.
I wonder now if more high-profile people from the Republican party would write letters such as George H. W. Bush did, and make them public, that it might have some impact?
Bottom line, though, is voters need to make it a real priority to vote out those who do nothing but offer "thoughts and prayers", and vote in those who are willing to take on the NRA.
The big NRA bucks come from the gun makers. As far as I know.
First, most gun owners aren't members of the NRA. But as the commenter pointed out a good many recreational activities, also, gun safety training certifications are done through the NRA.. It is a bit like a college football player not wanting to affiliate with the NCAA. They are the only game in town.
"But as the commenter pointed out a good many recreational activities, also, gun safety training certifications are done through the NRA.. It is a bit like a college football player not wanting to affiliate with the NCAA. They are the only game in town."
THAT is something I'd love to see change!
Not to mention that a lot of shooting ranges get their insurance through the NRA, and require their range members to be NRA members in order to stay eligible for the insurance.
My husband used to belong to a pistol club where he was in a target shooting league. A prerequisite to membership was a current membership to the NRA because at one time, they provided legal representation to the club for some lawsuit. He no longer belongs because of this requirement.
The NRA gets all the money it needs from Russia.
The irony being that Russia has some of the most restrictive gun laws in the world--- Putin isn't dumb.
Amazing isn't? We have people like Tucker, Hannity, Dreher, etc. praising Putin and Orban, etc. completely ignoring the fact that those wonderful people have restrictions that RW are/would be screaming about if they were here.
And gun manufacturers.
Apparently there was a lot of that going around.
Exactly.
Those poor gun show dealers in NW Indiana would be poorer if not for the drug lord/gangster cash that flows in from Chicago.
I'm failing to understand what your point is in regard to the days topic?
Pot stirring seems to be his point almost daily.
Well if that was the case then he failed at that, also
Legalizing drugs could solve a lot of that crime problem.
Cue a whole bunch of people promoting a vice. Great. I agree with legalizing pot because we shoulda learned our lesson with prohibition, but like the alcohol it is often compared to, it is still a vice.
It's not a vice at all.
Sure it is. That is why its defenders always say it's no worse than alcohol. Fact is, it does not belong in the human body any more than tobacco or alcohol does. The body must process it as a poison, not as a nutrient.
Red meat and cow's milk are vices by your definition
The Netherlands has not "legalized" but has decriminalized drugs. They have what they call a "social support system" to provide treatment for drug users.
https://www.government.nl/topics/drugs/what-is-addiction-care
I wish. But criminals love the life of crime. If they can't sell drugs, they'll sell women or children or kidnap people or run protection rackets.
Yes, but not all criminal enterprises are equal. Drugs are easy to supply and in high demand. That tends to create more suppliers and grow a large criminal industry. Those other crimes you mentioned are much higher risk and more difficult to sustain and supply. It's the reason that Prohibition resulted in a huge spike in organized crime.
They are just finding and supplying a market demand. The war on drugs (and other vices) is simply a profit center for the law enforcement/prison industrial complex.
Years ago I read an analysis about the entrepreneurial skills most criminals possess. In the non-criminal world they could be successful. But they like the buzz of that frisson of risk.
Actually they are socially and economically not positioned to enter the non-criminal entrepreneurial world. They adapt themselves to their environment as a survival strategy.
I was thinking more that they share the same entrepreneurial skill set. But I do know some shady characters who are attracted to the excitement of the underworld.
Perfect CEO material.
Yes. Along with legalizing prostitution. Let’s be honest; a lot of these mass shooters are sexually frustrated, socially awkward young men awash in overwhelming and erratic male hormones.
Sorry, but legalizing the exploitation of women ain't the way to go. Stop the "boys will be boys" bullshit right now.
Some would say that if prostitution is legal, well paid and regulated, it’s not exploitation. I’m just tossing out a little hand grenade here. Stopping “boys will be boys” seems like a more impossible dream than allowing cooling their jets.
It's exploitation because it objectifies humans by making them into commodities. Besides, do you really believe that a good fuck is all a mass shooter needs for their murderous impulses to stop?
No, 60% of them were previous domestic violence offenders. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g5g7OE3REME
I make the case that those statistics are supportive of my solution, rather than undercutting it. They have issues with females that might be assuaged. However, recent mass shootings seem to be unattached young males.
Huh?
Sorry ladies, but for the good of the country I need to propose we adopt a "Fuck an Incel" week. Think of the lives saved. But it is up to women, once again, to fix the mess we men made. /s
Fuck that. Those incels have hands they should make better use of them than pulling triggers. Those misogynist MFers should maybe stop being hateful violent domestic terrorists.
Most of the time, a black market is what raises prices. It constricts the supply. The prices for legal weed should be considerably lower than when it was illegal - otherwise, why not get it from local growers, or grow your own? Has your state actually legalized weed altogether (production, sale, and possession) or just decriminalized possession? It sounds like the supply is over-regulated and over-constricted. Drug companies can't just decide to raise prices if the market is allowed to function.
Weed isn't even a drug, Why are you seeming to put it in the same category as coke and ecstasy and oxycodone?
Because up until recently it has been illegal (and at the Federal level it still is). That's all that matters from the point of discussing black markets and pricing.
This is why I grow my own homie. Better quality than the dispos and a fraction of the price. Shiiiid in Denver I can buy clones at Kind Love. Don't even gotta shop for seed on the black market.
Travis, here in Illinois clones aren't available, but I get my seeds from reputable seed houses, not the black market. There are several (not naming them here; don't want to aggravate Charlie) that I buy from regularly and a couple offer free shipping. Happy growing, dear.
Sorry about y'alls taxes btw
I've worked in the industry and have access to prime cuts (and good fem/auto seeds). Was just offering it up as an example. Said seed houses are what I was referring to and I know of several good ones ;-)
The tax revenue from the drugs could be earmarked for treatment. Also, some people will use drugs like MDMA and cocaine recreationally (as they currently do). I suspect we'd have less overdoses and deaths as well because the supply would be uniform and regulated
No, because there will always be someone selling below the market. There will also be bootleg pharmaceuticals - oxycodone, fentanyl, xanax et al - that are smuggled into the US by China. Those drugs will never be authorized for recreational use, and shouldn't be.
Apparently the GOP congress members use cocaine at their orgies! 🤣
Still, the recreational use of drugs should be some sort of oxymoron.
There was a police report a decade or so ago that showed most guns used in crimes in NYC came from out-of-state, that's why we need Federal gun laws