The similarities between today's Republicans and fascists are strong, and I'm glad Saletan and others are pointing them out, but something I'm not seeing many writers discuss is the irony of Republicans, who make a strategy over degrading, dehumanizing labels and descriptions for Democrats, are now so butthurt over being called fascists. Someone from the Bulwark, please write a column about all the truly nasty, mendacious things Republicans have said about Democrats over just this past year.
Biden was being polite. Maga are fully fascists. The country was already divided. Probably to the point of no return. Honestly, Biden has probably kept things from exploding. Trump helped widen that division immensely. Biden isn’t the issue for them. ANY democratic politician and president in particular is or will be unacceptable. They want one party and only one party.
While I detest “whataboutism”, it is worth noting the hypocrisy of MAGA Republicans’ high dudgeon over being called out for their fealty to a strongman authoritarianism, when for a generation they have been calling run of the mill Democrats “Socialists”, “Marxists”, etc, all the while cashing their Soc Sec checks, availing themselves of Medicare, and depositing worry-free in FDIC-insured financial institutions. The social safety net is for me, not for thee! We live in an irony-free world, don’t we?
So, are there any Las Vegas odds on which major event will most likely bring Trump down? Then you get the follow up question of whether he will be found guilty on any of them?
We're fast approaching the dog catching the car here. Lindsay Graham and his "Indictments are for the Little People", where do people think this will go if Trump is actually found guilty and then sentenced to time? I really have no idea. Will he flee the country?
What I do look forward to are all of the lawyers and enablers who helped Trump do what he did. Those people really are likely to do time. I can count, Giuliani, Eastman ,Powell, Onato (sp) , Stone again, Bannon, Meadows, who else? The children?
We need some enterprising soul to make a deck of cards with all the major players. I'd like one. The one thing sure to drive Trump mad is seeing the opposition monetizing the event.
The reason Gym Jordan is terrified of being called a Fascist, is that if Trump does come back, Gym will no longer be able to wear just his shirt and tie into the Chambers of Congress.
Herr Drumpf will require his stooges to wear the full-on SS uniform with the stiff collared neck apparatus.
But at least Gym will be able to include on his tunic's breast his medal from The Ohio State University which he received for "Best Rasslin' Coach Who Didn't Rat Out The Pedophile Doctor"
Should the GOP....er....GQP ever regain control of both wings of Congress and the executive office, watch out. Head for the hills. Evacuate to Bonaire or Bora Bora. Because then the current collective narcissistic pseudo outrage of the semi-fascism appellation will transmogrify to the self contentment and comfort of full blown, overt fascism. But I am probably wrong. Why?
The Party of Trump is already bathing in the hellish cesspool of abject totalitarianism. They are just biding time to put the iron fist into play.
PS Ever notice that the closed and raised fist (see TFG at a mob rally) is now de rigueur.? So Mussolini.
When Biden was elected, I felt hope. Now, thanks to the F*ing Rs and Trump, I fear for the future. I'm 70 in a blue state - my life won't change. But for folks half my age with children, if Rs take over . . .
Mr. Saletan, I think your article about fascism would be improved by actually including the definition of fascism, rather than assuming people already know it. I would bet that many people think they know it and don’t.
I am loving Amanda Carpenter’s eagle eye on what is continuing to go on with Republican’s election machinations. I had no idea that Kemp swiveled hard right to court and include active election deniers. Will said Amanda would be continuing to do this work and I hope she does. I’m sorry that we need this but we do -- we need to be reminded that the machine Trump and his team set up continues to grind on. It hasn’t stopped. I don’t even think it even stuttered.
The Bacardi Sellers was uncomfortably fascinating. I don’t know if Mr. Sellers felt like a pincushion after it but I would have, especially after Tim’s off-hand remark that he was tired of diversity always having to center people’s trauma. (Also, I agree about Kamala Harris and think people should have been more serious about Amy Klobuchar.)
I’m guess I’m not as fiscally liberal as I thought because the in-for-the-dime-in-for-the-dollar hand-waving by Mr. Sellers took me aback. While I’m not personally resentful that I paid off my loans and others won’t -- it does bother me that the forgiveness is so broad and Mr. Sellers thought it should be even more generous. Er, what? What if it were smaller and targeted to just Pell Grant recipients (Hello there, I was one) or to people making less than 80K I don’t think there would be near the resentment and anger. I don’t buy Mr. Sellers glibness.
Well, on the good news side, Sarah Palin lost. I guess running away from her job as governor for speaking gigs with Fox, et al doesn't look too good on a résumé.
Well, she really didn't - it's the math used in rank choices that makes it seem that way. Most voters voted against her. That's one problem I have with ranked voting. Another is that in some places, there's only one party for the top 2.
I think that's what happened this time. I think the improvement is that next time the Republicans will realize that Palin is rather uniquely unpopular in Alaska and not vote for her. 60% R's and the democrat wins. I can see where if someone looks at it from a single election standpoint they'd say that's a bad result, but from a slightly (could be November) perspective, Alaskans will get the non-Palin Republican they want (if they're smart).
Of almost 54K Begich votes, almost half weren't for Palin as a second choice. That's telling.
As another example, if the Republicans had ranked choice in 2016, we probably don't have a Trump presidency.
The other benefit is that it might just allow third parties to build some support. A green vote isn't thrown away, because the second choice vote goes to the D or R the person considers their second choice. Allows for voting for Green, Libertarian, Nationalist, Socialist, etc. without throwing the vote away. So we could get a true sense of the support of such parties and they could in theory build off of their (limited) success. Depending on your mindset, it is more representative than just getting the same old two choices every time.
I agree Biden owes Republicans an apology for stating the obvious--- they are semi-fascists.
He should do so immediately after the Republican Party apologizes for calling Democrats socialists, communists, groomers and baby killers.
I understand why Maggie Hassan went all squishy over it calling it painting with too broad a brush. But really until the GOP actually makes an effort to distance themselves from the semi-fascists in their midst it is clear they are willing to be fellow travelers with them.
If a duck looks like a duck, sounds like a duck and walks like a duck--- it's probably a duck.
PS. I think Democrats should subvert and repurpose "Let's go, Brandon!" and turn it on it's head as a way of mocking the MAGAts.
When a party kicks out a rock-solid conservative like Liz Cheney out of the party for investigating an attempt to subvert a fair election and solidly buys into Trump, they have painted themselves as vivid color fascists. Heck, they dumped the entire paint store inventory over their heads. It will take a long time to rid themselves of that!
I do think the MAGA Republicans meet the definition of fascism. More importantly they meet the definition of terrorism. Their ardent refusal to do anything about gun violence that could help stave off mass shootings in public places like schools, grocery stores, concerts, churches, etc. is intentional. It destabilizes the public’s perception of the government’s ability to protect them which is one of government’s primary functions. January 6 was purely and simply a terrorist operation that was intended to overthrow the legally elected government violently. The fact that Trump planned it and wanted to personally lead it is indicative that he is a fascist.
Fascist regimes tend to make constant use of patriotic mottos, slogans, symbols, songs, and other paraphernalia. Flags are seen everywhere, as are flag symbols on clothing and in public displays.
Disdain for the Recognition of Human Rights
Because of fear of enemies and the need for security, the people in fascist regimes are persuaded that human rights can be ignored in certain cases because of “need.” The people tend to look the other way or even approve of torture, summary executions, assassinations, and long incarcerations of prisoners.
Identification of Enemies/Scapegoats as a Unifying Cause
The people are rallied into a unifying patriotic frenzy over the need to eliminate a perceived common threat or foe: racial , ethnic or religious minorities; liberals; communists; socialists, terrorists…
Supremacy of the Military
Even when there are widespread domestic problems, the military is given a disproportionate amount of government funding, and the domestic agenda is neglected. Soldiers and military service are glamorized.
Rampant Sexism
The governments of fascist nations tend to be almost exclusively male-dominated. Under fascist regimes, traditional gender roles are made more rigid. Opposition to abortion is high, as is homophobia and anti-gay legislation.
Controlled Mass Media
Sometimes the media is directly controlled by the government, but in other cases, the media is indirectly controlled by government regulation or by sympathetic media spokespeople and executives. Government censorship and secrecy, especially in war time, are very common.
Obsession with National Security
Fear of hostile foreign powers is used as a motivational tool by the government over the masses.
Religion and Government are Intertwined
Governments in fascist nations tend to use the most common religion in the nation as a tool to manipulate public opinion. Religious rhetoric and terminology is common from government leaders, even when the major tenets of the religion are diametrically opposed to the government’s policies or actions.
Protection of Corporate Power
The industrial and business aristocracy of a fascist nation often are the ones who put the government leaders into power, creating a mutually beneficial business/government relationship and power elite.
Suppression of Labor Power
Because the organizing power of labor is the only real threat to a fascist government, labor unions are either eliminated entirely, or are severely suppressed .
Disdain for Intellectuals and the Arts
Fascist nations tend to promote and tolerate open hostility to higher education and academia. It is not uncommon for professors and other academics to be censored or even arrested. Free expression in the arts is openly attacked, and governments often refuse to fund the arts.
Obsession with Crime and Punishment
Under fascist regimes, the police are given almost limitless power to enforce laws. The people are often willing to overlook police abuses and even forego civil liberties in the name of patriotism. There is often a national police force with virtually unlimited power in fascist nations.
Rampant Cronyism and Corruption
Fascist regimes almost always are governed by groups of friends and associates who appoint each other to government positions and use governmental power and authority to protect their friends from accountability. It is not uncommon in fascist regimes for national resources and even treasures to be appropriated or even outright stolen by government leaders.
Fraudulent Elections
Sometimes elections in fascist nations are a complete sham. Other times elections are manipulated by smear campaigns against or even assassination of opposition candidates, use of legislation to control voting numbers or political district boundaries, and manipulation of the media. Fascist nations also typically use their judiciaries to manipulate or control elections.
Amanda has big fan over at NRO.
https://www.nationalreview.com/corner/amanda-carpenters-preposterous-swing-and-miss-at-brian-kemp/
The similarities between today's Republicans and fascists are strong, and I'm glad Saletan and others are pointing them out, but something I'm not seeing many writers discuss is the irony of Republicans, who make a strategy over degrading, dehumanizing labels and descriptions for Democrats, are now so butthurt over being called fascists. Someone from the Bulwark, please write a column about all the truly nasty, mendacious things Republicans have said about Democrats over just this past year.
Biden was being polite. Maga are fully fascists. The country was already divided. Probably to the point of no return. Honestly, Biden has probably kept things from exploding. Trump helped widen that division immensely. Biden isn’t the issue for them. ANY democratic politician and president in particular is or will be unacceptable. They want one party and only one party.
"Semi-Fascism" is like being "a little pregnant." Call it what it is.
Why Trump Can’t Be Prosecuted By Donald J Trump (and ghostwriters)
DOJ OLC says you can’t prosecute a sitting president.
I’m the President! I won!
The Docs collected by the failed FBI were secret McDonald’s Dollar Meals. Must be kept from Burger King!
I am only subject to prosecution when the moon is in the seventh house and Jupiter aligns with Mars.
I can’t be prosecuted on Mondays, Thursdays, Tuesdays, Fridays or Wednesdays. And Judges don’t do weekends!
My hair is too great to be prosecuted!
Bill Barr will obstruct Justice again (well maybe not).
I look terrible in orange!
I was calling bullshit until that last one. That convinced me.
While I detest “whataboutism”, it is worth noting the hypocrisy of MAGA Republicans’ high dudgeon over being called out for their fealty to a strongman authoritarianism, when for a generation they have been calling run of the mill Democrats “Socialists”, “Marxists”, etc, all the while cashing their Soc Sec checks, availing themselves of Medicare, and depositing worry-free in FDIC-insured financial institutions. The social safety net is for me, not for thee! We live in an irony-free world, don’t we?
So, are there any Las Vegas odds on which major event will most likely bring Trump down? Then you get the follow up question of whether he will be found guilty on any of them?
We're fast approaching the dog catching the car here. Lindsay Graham and his "Indictments are for the Little People", where do people think this will go if Trump is actually found guilty and then sentenced to time? I really have no idea. Will he flee the country?
What I do look forward to are all of the lawyers and enablers who helped Trump do what he did. Those people really are likely to do time. I can count, Giuliani, Eastman ,Powell, Onato (sp) , Stone again, Bannon, Meadows, who else? The children?
We need some enterprising soul to make a deck of cards with all the major players. I'd like one. The one thing sure to drive Trump mad is seeing the opposition monetizing the event.
Well they had them for Sadaam .
The reason Gym Jordan is terrified of being called a Fascist, is that if Trump does come back, Gym will no longer be able to wear just his shirt and tie into the Chambers of Congress.
Herr Drumpf will require his stooges to wear the full-on SS uniform with the stiff collared neck apparatus.
But at least Gym will be able to include on his tunic's breast his medal from The Ohio State University which he received for "Best Rasslin' Coach Who Didn't Rat Out The Pedophile Doctor"
Thanks, Christopher. The "Gym" word always cracks me up. I think anyone who is that angry all the time is suppressing something.
Should the GOP....er....GQP ever regain control of both wings of Congress and the executive office, watch out. Head for the hills. Evacuate to Bonaire or Bora Bora. Because then the current collective narcissistic pseudo outrage of the semi-fascism appellation will transmogrify to the self contentment and comfort of full blown, overt fascism. But I am probably wrong. Why?
The Party of Trump is already bathing in the hellish cesspool of abject totalitarianism. They are just biding time to put the iron fist into play.
PS Ever notice that the closed and raised fist (see TFG at a mob rally) is now de rigueur.? So Mussolini.
When Biden was elected, I felt hope. Now, thanks to the F*ing Rs and Trump, I fear for the future. I'm 70 in a blue state - my life won't change. But for folks half my age with children, if Rs take over . . .
Mr. Saletan, I think your article about fascism would be improved by actually including the definition of fascism, rather than assuming people already know it. I would bet that many people think they know it and don’t.
I am loving Amanda Carpenter’s eagle eye on what is continuing to go on with Republican’s election machinations. I had no idea that Kemp swiveled hard right to court and include active election deniers. Will said Amanda would be continuing to do this work and I hope she does. I’m sorry that we need this but we do -- we need to be reminded that the machine Trump and his team set up continues to grind on. It hasn’t stopped. I don’t even think it even stuttered.
The Bacardi Sellers was uncomfortably fascinating. I don’t know if Mr. Sellers felt like a pincushion after it but I would have, especially after Tim’s off-hand remark that he was tired of diversity always having to center people’s trauma. (Also, I agree about Kamala Harris and think people should have been more serious about Amy Klobuchar.)
I’m guess I’m not as fiscally liberal as I thought because the in-for-the-dime-in-for-the-dollar hand-waving by Mr. Sellers took me aback. While I’m not personally resentful that I paid off my loans and others won’t -- it does bother me that the forgiveness is so broad and Mr. Sellers thought it should be even more generous. Er, what? What if it were smaller and targeted to just Pell Grant recipients (Hello there, I was one) or to people making less than 80K I don’t think there would be near the resentment and anger. I don’t buy Mr. Sellers glibness.
Er ... Bakari. Sorry, Mr. Sellers, if you read this. I hate people messing up my name, too.
Well, on the good news side, Sarah Palin lost. I guess running away from her job as governor for speaking gigs with Fox, et al doesn't look too good on a résumé.
Well, she really didn't - it's the math used in rank choices that makes it seem that way. Most voters voted against her. That's one problem I have with ranked voting. Another is that in some places, there's only one party for the top 2.
I think that's what happened this time. I think the improvement is that next time the Republicans will realize that Palin is rather uniquely unpopular in Alaska and not vote for her. 60% R's and the democrat wins. I can see where if someone looks at it from a single election standpoint they'd say that's a bad result, but from a slightly (could be November) perspective, Alaskans will get the non-Palin Republican they want (if they're smart).
Of almost 54K Begich votes, almost half weren't for Palin as a second choice. That's telling.
As another example, if the Republicans had ranked choice in 2016, we probably don't have a Trump presidency.
The other benefit is that it might just allow third parties to build some support. A green vote isn't thrown away, because the second choice vote goes to the D or R the person considers their second choice. Allows for voting for Green, Libertarian, Nationalist, Socialist, etc. without throwing the vote away. So we could get a true sense of the support of such parties and they could in theory build off of their (limited) success. Depending on your mindset, it is more representative than just getting the same old two choices every time.
I agree Biden owes Republicans an apology for stating the obvious--- they are semi-fascists.
He should do so immediately after the Republican Party apologizes for calling Democrats socialists, communists, groomers and baby killers.
I understand why Maggie Hassan went all squishy over it calling it painting with too broad a brush. But really until the GOP actually makes an effort to distance themselves from the semi-fascists in their midst it is clear they are willing to be fellow travelers with them.
If a duck looks like a duck, sounds like a duck and walks like a duck--- it's probably a duck.
PS. I think Democrats should subvert and repurpose "Let's go, Brandon!" and turn it on it's head as a way of mocking the MAGAts.
When a party kicks out a rock-solid conservative like Liz Cheney out of the party for investigating an attempt to subvert a fair election and solidly buys into Trump, they have painted themselves as vivid color fascists. Heck, they dumped the entire paint store inventory over their heads. It will take a long time to rid themselves of that!
Great podcast conversation between Bakari, Lis, and Tim (3 NYT bestselling authors!).
In state politics, being the one who waits for the governor to die is a totally powerless position.
IT is a good spot to place a troublesome ally.
Is Kemp following the maxim "Keep your friends close and your enemies closer" ?
I do think the MAGA Republicans meet the definition of fascism. More importantly they meet the definition of terrorism. Their ardent refusal to do anything about gun violence that could help stave off mass shootings in public places like schools, grocery stores, concerts, churches, etc. is intentional. It destabilizes the public’s perception of the government’s ability to protect them which is one of government’s primary functions. January 6 was purely and simply a terrorist operation that was intended to overthrow the legally elected government violently. The fact that Trump planned it and wanted to personally lead it is indicative that he is a fascist.
14 Characteristics of Fascism:
Powerful and Continuing Nationalism
Fascist regimes tend to make constant use of patriotic mottos, slogans, symbols, songs, and other paraphernalia. Flags are seen everywhere, as are flag symbols on clothing and in public displays.
Disdain for the Recognition of Human Rights
Because of fear of enemies and the need for security, the people in fascist regimes are persuaded that human rights can be ignored in certain cases because of “need.” The people tend to look the other way or even approve of torture, summary executions, assassinations, and long incarcerations of prisoners.
Identification of Enemies/Scapegoats as a Unifying Cause
The people are rallied into a unifying patriotic frenzy over the need to eliminate a perceived common threat or foe: racial , ethnic or religious minorities; liberals; communists; socialists, terrorists…
Supremacy of the Military
Even when there are widespread domestic problems, the military is given a disproportionate amount of government funding, and the domestic agenda is neglected. Soldiers and military service are glamorized.
Rampant Sexism
The governments of fascist nations tend to be almost exclusively male-dominated. Under fascist regimes, traditional gender roles are made more rigid. Opposition to abortion is high, as is homophobia and anti-gay legislation.
Controlled Mass Media
Sometimes the media is directly controlled by the government, but in other cases, the media is indirectly controlled by government regulation or by sympathetic media spokespeople and executives. Government censorship and secrecy, especially in war time, are very common.
Obsession with National Security
Fear of hostile foreign powers is used as a motivational tool by the government over the masses.
Religion and Government are Intertwined
Governments in fascist nations tend to use the most common religion in the nation as a tool to manipulate public opinion. Religious rhetoric and terminology is common from government leaders, even when the major tenets of the religion are diametrically opposed to the government’s policies or actions.
Protection of Corporate Power
The industrial and business aristocracy of a fascist nation often are the ones who put the government leaders into power, creating a mutually beneficial business/government relationship and power elite.
Suppression of Labor Power
Because the organizing power of labor is the only real threat to a fascist government, labor unions are either eliminated entirely, or are severely suppressed .
Disdain for Intellectuals and the Arts
Fascist nations tend to promote and tolerate open hostility to higher education and academia. It is not uncommon for professors and other academics to be censored or even arrested. Free expression in the arts is openly attacked, and governments often refuse to fund the arts.
Obsession with Crime and Punishment
Under fascist regimes, the police are given almost limitless power to enforce laws. The people are often willing to overlook police abuses and even forego civil liberties in the name of patriotism. There is often a national police force with virtually unlimited power in fascist nations.
Rampant Cronyism and Corruption
Fascist regimes almost always are governed by groups of friends and associates who appoint each other to government positions and use governmental power and authority to protect their friends from accountability. It is not uncommon in fascist regimes for national resources and even treasures to be appropriated or even outright stolen by government leaders.
Fraudulent Elections
Sometimes elections in fascist nations are a complete sham. Other times elections are manipulated by smear campaigns against or even assassination of opposition candidates, use of legislation to control voting numbers or political district boundaries, and manipulation of the media. Fascist nations also typically use their judiciaries to manipulate or control elections.
Hmm, the shoe definitely fits...