So, first, I'm likewise a Boomer. No sweat. Your assertion about this demographic that touched off this little spat does not offend me personally, because while that is indeed one facet of my self identity, it's a relatively minor one. And even if it were more important to me than it is, I'm a fairly old tree with a lot of hard bark, and it would take more than this to raise my ire much. So, what I'll say here doesn't come from that.
But it may be of more importance to others, and I can see why some would be unhappy with the first sentence of your comment, because while you in fact did not say "all" Boomers, you in no way qualified your statement to indicate otherwise. And the specific use of the word "the" before the words "baby boomers" clearly denotes that the group that those words represent is to be considered as a whole, since as noted, you offered no qualification to indicate otherwise. And the natural follow-on to the meaning of your sentence is therefore that all baby boomers are "Nazi Americans", from which it may be surmised that you meant Trump supporters.
This may not be what you were trying to say, and from your subsequent comments I take you at your word that it wasn't. But it was, by common usage and understanding of our language, what you did in fact 'say' - however unintentionally - in a sentence that was overly broad for your purpose and included a cutting rhetorical comparison device (Nazi Americans). And that's the reason that you got the responses that you did. Including from me, the poor placement of which also led to a bit of a misunderstanding as to my specific meaning, a fact I apologized for and will now correct by noting I probably should have posted it under your original comment for clarity's sake.
You may well view this as nit picking, or see it as completely wrong. And if that's the case, that's fine. You asked me a question about my reply, you were entitled to one, and I've done my best to explain. I'll only add that it's helpful for all of us to sometimes remember that while our thoughts may be perfectly clear in our own minds, it's the words we use to express them that make them clear for others. Beyond that, I'd only ask that you re-read that sentence a couple of times, bearing in mind what I've said here, and perhaps you'll more clearly understand the point I've tried to make, both here and in my reply that you asked me about.
Of course all Italians are not great cooks. I should know. My father was 1st generation Italian in this country and was a very good and skillful cook...so much so that he built, owned and ran a pretty successful Italian / American restaurant in my hometown. I, on the other hand, can be generously described as a something-less-than-mediocre cook. But then again, the Dago Red flowing through my veins has been reduced by half due to my maternal DNA.
Agree to disagree it is, irrespective of nit-picking or not. However, in fairness I'd like to point out that I whole-heartedly agree with you on one thing, that being that my father and all of his brothers, my wife's father and his brother along with my mother's older sister and her husband are indeed no doubt spinning in their graves at what's going on today, how many of the children of their generation have been involved in supporting and promoting it, and what a blatant disrespect and affront to their military service and sacrifices on behalf of them that that represents.
Quick and simple answer, though there's a bit more to it than just this...Italian assertion didn't ascribe a negative attribute to the 'group'. Boomer assertion did (American Nazi). Positive / negative often affects perceived meaning in different ways. Yeah, I know...another 'language' thing. Sorry. Would be happy to discuss further sometime if so inclined. If not, I get it. Words and language and how they work in our communication with each other are of interest to me, but not everyone. Have enjoyed this little back and forth with you about it.
Fair enough. Spinning my wheels in offering a small facet of a larger explanation of how perceived meaning by a reader can at times differ from the intended meaning of a writer isn't the best use for your time or mine. So enough said, and have a good day as well.
I'll try to answer that before the evening is out. Am responding at the moment so you'll know I got your reply and am not ignoring it. Just have a number of things that need to be seen to and it will take a little while. In the meantime, I'll offer some criticism of myself. This was probably not the right place in this conversation to insert that comment, at least not without a little modification, since it led you to think I was speaking specifically of your one reply to 'Old Man', and I wasn't. In doing so I made a mistake I see as similar to the one I think you made which started this whole angry little thread: not being as accurate in my language as I should have been, and I apologize for that. That you misunderstood me is my responsibility, not yours.
You're swinging a pretty broad and sharp axe here, friend. You may want to be a little more careful with it lest you cut yourself.
So, first, I'm likewise a Boomer. No sweat. Your assertion about this demographic that touched off this little spat does not offend me personally, because while that is indeed one facet of my self identity, it's a relatively minor one. And even if it were more important to me than it is, I'm a fairly old tree with a lot of hard bark, and it would take more than this to raise my ire much. So, what I'll say here doesn't come from that.
But it may be of more importance to others, and I can see why some would be unhappy with the first sentence of your comment, because while you in fact did not say "all" Boomers, you in no way qualified your statement to indicate otherwise. And the specific use of the word "the" before the words "baby boomers" clearly denotes that the group that those words represent is to be considered as a whole, since as noted, you offered no qualification to indicate otherwise. And the natural follow-on to the meaning of your sentence is therefore that all baby boomers are "Nazi Americans", from which it may be surmised that you meant Trump supporters.
This may not be what you were trying to say, and from your subsequent comments I take you at your word that it wasn't. But it was, by common usage and understanding of our language, what you did in fact 'say' - however unintentionally - in a sentence that was overly broad for your purpose and included a cutting rhetorical comparison device (Nazi Americans). And that's the reason that you got the responses that you did. Including from me, the poor placement of which also led to a bit of a misunderstanding as to my specific meaning, a fact I apologized for and will now correct by noting I probably should have posted it under your original comment for clarity's sake.
You may well view this as nit picking, or see it as completely wrong. And if that's the case, that's fine. You asked me a question about my reply, you were entitled to one, and I've done my best to explain. I'll only add that it's helpful for all of us to sometimes remember that while our thoughts may be perfectly clear in our own minds, it's the words we use to express them that make them clear for others. Beyond that, I'd only ask that you re-read that sentence a couple of times, bearing in mind what I've said here, and perhaps you'll more clearly understand the point I've tried to make, both here and in my reply that you asked me about.
Ha! & for real LOL!
Of course all Italians are not great cooks. I should know. My father was 1st generation Italian in this country and was a very good and skillful cook...so much so that he built, owned and ran a pretty successful Italian / American restaurant in my hometown. I, on the other hand, can be generously described as a something-less-than-mediocre cook. But then again, the Dago Red flowing through my veins has been reduced by half due to my maternal DNA.
Agree to disagree it is, irrespective of nit-picking or not. However, in fairness I'd like to point out that I whole-heartedly agree with you on one thing, that being that my father and all of his brothers, my wife's father and his brother along with my mother's older sister and her husband are indeed no doubt spinning in their graves at what's going on today, how many of the children of their generation have been involved in supporting and promoting it, and what a blatant disrespect and affront to their military service and sacrifices on behalf of them that that represents.
Take care...
Quick and simple answer, though there's a bit more to it than just this...Italian assertion didn't ascribe a negative attribute to the 'group'. Boomer assertion did (American Nazi). Positive / negative often affects perceived meaning in different ways. Yeah, I know...another 'language' thing. Sorry. Would be happy to discuss further sometime if so inclined. If not, I get it. Words and language and how they work in our communication with each other are of interest to me, but not everyone. Have enjoyed this little back and forth with you about it.
Fair enough. Spinning my wheels in offering a small facet of a larger explanation of how perceived meaning by a reader can at times differ from the intended meaning of a writer isn't the best use for your time or mine. So enough said, and have a good day as well.
I'll try to answer that before the evening is out. Am responding at the moment so you'll know I got your reply and am not ignoring it. Just have a number of things that need to be seen to and it will take a little while. In the meantime, I'll offer some criticism of myself. This was probably not the right place in this conversation to insert that comment, at least not without a little modification, since it led you to think I was speaking specifically of your one reply to 'Old Man', and I wasn't. In doing so I made a mistake I see as similar to the one I think you made which started this whole angry little thread: not being as accurate in my language as I should have been, and I apologize for that. That you misunderstood me is my responsibility, not yours.