I was a child in the 70's and 80's. We all regarded with horror how police in the easten bloc could just throw you in the gulag or take you to the courtyard for a firing squad. We were proud of the protections of the American system. Now, the folks who want to make this country "great" want to go beyond the worse abuses of the Soviets. Progress!
I was a child in the 70's and 80's. We all regarded with horror how police in the easten bloc could just throw you in the gulag or take you to the courtyard for a firing squad. We were proud of the protections of the American system. Now, the folks who want to make this country "great" want to go beyond the worse abuses of the Soviets. Progress!
"The protections of the American system" were largely an illusion though.
Sure, if you were a moderately wealthy white person you weren't likely to be victimized, but lynchings were rampant in the cold war era and police abuse and brutality aren't new phenomenon.
It's not so much that I'm mourning the cold war era justice system. As you correctly note,it was far from perfect. I'm lamenting the loss of a broader consensus that everyone deserved their day in court, and innocent until proven guilty. MAGA just wants to go vigilante and call it a day.
Interesting, guess I have to update my priors on that. I assumed they were more common than that set of statistics suggests. Thanks for pointing that out!
No problem, and I know you know this, but for anyone else, I'm not trying to minimize the larger point, or the violence that was prevalent that wasn't an actual lynching.
With all of the accusations of conspiracies against conservatives, you'd think they'd want to preserve due process for fear of being unjustly swept up by [insert hyperbolic description of their perceived enemies]. As is usually the case, people are fine with something as long as they don't think it will impact them negatively.
They are all in favor of it as long as it is someone else who suffers and there is no accountability for them in the process. They also like to pretend that those whom they oppress are unwilling or unable to fight back. It reminds me of Mike Tyson's enlightened quote about everyone having a plan until they get punched in the mouth.
And of course they would ignore the child sex abusers in their own ranks. Evangelical organizations are rife with child abuse and abuse of women. But severe penalties/firing squads/public hangings are reserved for libruls.
The right wing hatred for communism was always about the end, not the means. Turns out they love all the authoritarian stuff, they just hate the idea of equality.
Sorry, can you point to examples of what Charlie describes as the far left (AOC, Bernie, Maya Wiley etc) calling for extrajudicial killings of right wingers? I think I have missed those.
I find the question obtuse to the point of being disingenuous. Of course I'm not talking about the US - that's a red herring. I'm talking about the Stalinist purges, the Holodomor, the Maoist purges, and Pol Pot, to name just the best known examples.
ItтАЩs not a perfect correlation, more of a trend. IтАЩm very familiar with left leaning people who have policed my speech, by shaming and offering тАЬreeducationтАЭ. I was called out for saying тАЬkill two birds with one stoneтАЭ, because тАЬsometimes what we say influences what we doтАЭ. Obviously not the same as extrajudicial killing, but the cure outweighed the тАЬoffenseтАЭ.
GG, I must say that what comes to mind for me are my far left cohorts who thought blowing up ski areas and pounding 60 penny nails into trees (so dangerous for lumberjacks) was a fair defense of the environment.
Tankies (authoritarian left wingers) are not bothered by Russia invaded Ukraine and either support Putin, ot call for 'peace' without demanding Russia withdraw from a country russia uses terrorist tactics on. Tankies are considered by most to be on the far left. For example, Tulsi Gabbard once worked for Bernie Sanders. https://twitter.com/tankiesfortulsi?lang=en
They are more like the Nazis every day. Communists as well, since at a certain point communism and fascism are largely the same in their societal effect, but we're looking at the extreme and extremist right.
I was a child in the 70's and 80's. We all regarded with horror how police in the easten bloc could just throw you in the gulag or take you to the courtyard for a firing squad. We were proud of the protections of the American system. Now, the folks who want to make this country "great" want to go beyond the worse abuses of the Soviets. Progress!
"The protections of the American system" were largely an illusion though.
Sure, if you were a moderately wealthy white person you weren't likely to be victimized, but lynchings were rampant in the cold war era and police abuse and brutality aren't new phenomenon.
It's not so much that I'm mourning the cold war era justice system. As you correctly note,it was far from perfect. I'm lamenting the loss of a broader consensus that everyone deserved their day in court, and innocent until proven guilty. MAGA just wants to go vigilante and call it a day.
Not disputing your larger point, but lynchings dropped off a lot by WWII.
http://law2.umkc.edu/faculty/projects/ftrials/shipp/lynchingyear.html
Interesting, guess I have to update my priors on that. I assumed they were more common than that set of statistics suggests. Thanks for pointing that out!
No problem, and I know you know this, but for anyone else, I'm not trying to minimize the larger point, or the violence that was prevalent that wasn't an actual lynching.
With all of the accusations of conspiracies against conservatives, you'd think they'd want to preserve due process for fear of being unjustly swept up by [insert hyperbolic description of their perceived enemies]. As is usually the case, people are fine with something as long as they don't think it will impact them negatively.
Starts a few miles south of Valdosta on I-75.
They are all in favor of it as long as it is someone else who suffers and there is no accountability for them in the process. They also like to pretend that those whom they oppress are unwilling or unable to fight back. It reminds me of Mike Tyson's enlightened quote about everyone having a plan until they get punched in the mouth.
And of course they would ignore the child sex abusers in their own ranks. Evangelical organizations are rife with child abuse and abuse of women. But severe penalties/firing squads/public hangings are reserved for libruls.
To the right, pedophiles, murderers, and drug dealers are all Democrats. (Which may or may not be the whole point.)
They ignore child sex abusers ANYwhere, because they're too busy trying to stop transgenders from existing.
Yea, their sexual morality is highly situational. And never applies to themselves. тАЬDo as I say, not as I doтАЭ is their unspoken but obvious credo.
They havenтАЩt taken Rudy out and put him down yet, have they?
HeтАЩs innocent. ItтАЩs a witch hunt.
Macbeth only had three witches. The GOP must be witches all the way down.
ЁЯШВ ЁЯШВ
ЁЯСП
The right wing hatred for communism was always about the end, not the means. Turns out they love all the authoritarian stuff, they just hate the idea of equality.
An example of the тАЬhorseshoe effectтАЭ. The extremes on the continuum become ideological twins.
Sorry, can you point to examples of what Charlie describes as the far left (AOC, Bernie, Maya Wiley etc) calling for extrajudicial killings of right wingers? I think I have missed those.
The conversation started with Communism, a bona fide far left movement, under which millions were murdered extrajudicially.
I find the question obtuse to the point of being disingenuous. Of course I'm not talking about the US - that's a red herring. I'm talking about the Stalinist purges, the Holodomor, the Maoist purges, and Pol Pot, to name just the best known examples.
ItтАЩs not a perfect correlation, more of a trend. IтАЩm very familiar with left leaning people who have policed my speech, by shaming and offering тАЬreeducationтАЭ. I was called out for saying тАЬkill two birds with one stoneтАЭ, because тАЬsometimes what we say influences what we doтАЭ. Obviously not the same as extrajudicial killing, but the cure outweighed the тАЬoffenseтАЭ.
GG, I must say that what comes to mind for me are my far left cohorts who thought blowing up ski areas and pounding 60 penny nails into trees (so dangerous for lumberjacks) was a fair defense of the environment.
It is a rather large step from policing your speech (which you can often ignore, anyway, TBH--especially if you are not terminally online) and
extra-judicial killing (or even a quick (probably sham) trial followed by a rapid execution w/o appeal.
This is true. And this is what I acknowledged in my remark.
Tankies (authoritarian left wingers) are not bothered by Russia invaded Ukraine and either support Putin, ot call for 'peace' without demanding Russia withdraw from a country russia uses terrorist tactics on. Tankies are considered by most to be on the far left. For example, Tulsi Gabbard once worked for Bernie Sanders. https://twitter.com/tankiesfortulsi?lang=en
You know, the always enthusiastically projecting GOP is sort of like becoming.....wait for it....wait.....CCCP Communists.
Maybe a hybrid of Russian oligarchy and CCCP social management.
They are more like the Nazis every day. Communists as well, since at a certain point communism and fascism are largely the same in their societal effect, but we're looking at the extreme and extremist right.