My only addition: I think it also goes to show an old formulation that we (the US) tend to keep to: Our enemies are the governments of Iran/Russia/NK, not their people and we would prefer to live in peace, friendship, and collective security with them but their governments make that impossible or their cost unacceptable. I see the duty t…
My only addition: I think it also goes to show an old formulation that we (the US) tend to keep to: Our enemies are the governments of Iran/Russia/NK, not their people and we would prefer to live in peace, friendship, and collective security with them but their governments make that impossible or their cost unacceptable. I see the duty to warn approach as action matching words - we are not at war with the people of Russia or Iran as such, and we will inform their governments who are a better position to protect the lives of their people through dissemination of information (which their people may not believe if it came directly from us) and physical security as well as give information to US nationals through our own embassies and institutions. Again, always imperfectly. And again, there will always be shameless, cruel, or blinkered people who see this as a weakness rather than part of America's undeniable strength.
Maybe they don't want to protect their people. Maybe they want scared, insecure people who will not question the government who tells them they will protect them next time.
See also George W Bush's comments on the US not being a civilizational clash/crusade with Islam and the "Islamic World" following 9/11. JVL has brought this up before and it remains a great example of what I'm trying to get at - statements made, policy identified, action take so imperfectly, fools and ghouls saying how wrong it is/was.
That's because in *this* country, the *people* are the problem. At least a significant minority share of them are anyway. Bush gets an A for effort there in my book--and I'm no fan of Bush.
9/11 and the vile cultural follow up to it was at a very formative time in my life. Raised in a “normie” Republican household, I saw my high school’s Dean (Muslim convert to Christianity) and a classmate (Muslim) get a level of vitriol I hadn’t even thought humans could put out in a civilized country.
It really broke the country’s brain and the worst of us came out. We’ve been in a series of relapses since then without proper rehab.
Basically, the people in our country need serious therapy.
Israel as a nation is going through that same kind of moment as we speak.
My own experiences around 9/11 were very formative as well, having a literal front row seat for it growing up in Queens as a teen at the time--a real part of NYC I might add, unlike JVL's Jersey faux-borough (take THAT JVL lol). I still remember the NY Post headlines about Sikh cab drivers being dragged out of cars and beaten for wearing turbans right after 9/11--even though they weren't even muslim, and even though muslims as a whole shouldn't have been blamed either. And then I watched all these "we need to pay Al Qaeda back the hard way" chicken-hawk conservative types sit out the coming conflicts--opting to go off to finance school while poor kids from Pennsylvania or Texas or West Virginia fought in their stead. It taught me a lot about how fake a lot of people in NYC are when it comes to living up to their virtue positions (the liberals there are no different either).
I don't think therapy can fix certain things about the human condition on relatively short timelines, and that only cultural shifts over time can slowly unseat what evolutionary psychology has embedded in most of us over the course of millennia. Just my personal take.
My only addition: I think it also goes to show an old formulation that we (the US) tend to keep to: Our enemies are the governments of Iran/Russia/NK, not their people and we would prefer to live in peace, friendship, and collective security with them but their governments make that impossible or their cost unacceptable. I see the duty to warn approach as action matching words - we are not at war with the people of Russia or Iran as such, and we will inform their governments who are a better position to protect the lives of their people through dissemination of information (which their people may not believe if it came directly from us) and physical security as well as give information to US nationals through our own embassies and institutions. Again, always imperfectly. And again, there will always be shameless, cruel, or blinkered people who see this as a weakness rather than part of America's undeniable strength.
Maybe they don't want to protect their people. Maybe they want scared, insecure people who will not question the government who tells them they will protect them next time.
See also George W Bush's comments on the US not being a civilizational clash/crusade with Islam and the "Islamic World" following 9/11. JVL has brought this up before and it remains a great example of what I'm trying to get at - statements made, policy identified, action take so imperfectly, fools and ghouls saying how wrong it is/was.
And yet Bush found numerous supporters for the idea that Saddam Hussein was behind the 9/11 attacks, helping him justify that war.
You beat me to this, great case in point.
Most people didn't pay attention to those comments and went on ahead hating all Muslims.
That's because in *this* country, the *people* are the problem. At least a significant minority share of them are anyway. Bush gets an A for effort there in my book--and I'm no fan of Bush.
9/11 and the vile cultural follow up to it was at a very formative time in my life. Raised in a “normie” Republican household, I saw my high school’s Dean (Muslim convert to Christianity) and a classmate (Muslim) get a level of vitriol I hadn’t even thought humans could put out in a civilized country.
It really broke the country’s brain and the worst of us came out. We’ve been in a series of relapses since then without proper rehab.
Basically, the people in our country need serious therapy.
Israel as a nation is going through that same kind of moment as we speak.
My own experiences around 9/11 were very formative as well, having a literal front row seat for it growing up in Queens as a teen at the time--a real part of NYC I might add, unlike JVL's Jersey faux-borough (take THAT JVL lol). I still remember the NY Post headlines about Sikh cab drivers being dragged out of cars and beaten for wearing turbans right after 9/11--even though they weren't even muslim, and even though muslims as a whole shouldn't have been blamed either. And then I watched all these "we need to pay Al Qaeda back the hard way" chicken-hawk conservative types sit out the coming conflicts--opting to go off to finance school while poor kids from Pennsylvania or Texas or West Virginia fought in their stead. It taught me a lot about how fake a lot of people in NYC are when it comes to living up to their virtue positions (the liberals there are no different either).
I don't think therapy can fix certain things about the human condition on relatively short timelines, and that only cultural shifts over time can slowly unseat what evolutionary psychology has embedded in most of us over the course of millennia. Just my personal take.
Haters gonna hate.