Respectfully, Biden still botched Afghanistan, and owns that 100%. Yes, the Trump admin negotiated the withdrawal, but Biden was responsible for the proper execution of it. This doesn’t mean Biden was a bad president. I also believe he did an exceptional job pulling NATO together and supporting Ukraine, as well as his leadership supporting Israel after the Oct 7th Hamas terrorist attack.
Respectfully, Biden still botched Afghanistan, and owns that 100%. Yes, the Trump admin negotiated the withdrawal, but Biden was responsible for the proper execution of it. This doesn’t mean Biden was a bad president. I also believe he did an exceptional job pulling NATO together and supporting Ukraine, as well as his leadership supporting Israel after the Oct 7th Hamas terrorist attack.
Look to Vietnam as a comparison. Over 60 servicemen were killed during the last month of the chaotic withdrawal. It's a miracle that the Afghanistan operation went as well as it did after 20 years of war and Trump's worst negotiated peace deal in history (he released Taliban 5,000 terrorist fighters back to the battlefield).
I don’t recall hearing anything like that from the media either, and I followed it closely across all media outlets. The media narrative was set on the first day from 15-20 seconds of video at the airport. You know, the clips of people running alongside the plane and packed in a cargo hold that outlets ran over and over.
Of course. Why did I bother to ask? Trump has corrupted the MSM part of our free press.
But, cable and broadcast news is not where most people get their news and their audiences are declining. So CBS’ cave may not matter all that much. The growth of independent news, like the Bulwark, and their social-media-sharing-ready content getting widely shared is a good thing.
Hubby McGee, Biden changed the withdrawal date from May to August to get more people out. When Felon Trump left office he had no logistical plan, none at all, to complete the orderly evacuation of either personnel or equipment within the agreed timeframe. If you would go to white house.gov you may see that Biden’s administration was not given any plans for evacuation because there were none. But the withdrawal date was three months away. Biden did want a September withdrawal date. How do you think the Taliban would have accepted that! 100%? No!
Katherine again, respectfully, no excuse. Biden was president. I'm a retired Army officer. 90 days is plenty of time to plan an effective withdrawal. Respectfully, please don't patronize me with a whitehouse.gov link. I'm a multiple deployed Iraq War vet - and led soldiers down range - and was permanently disabled while preparing for a deployment to Afghanistan. It is unwise to fall into the trap of believing "your guy" can do no wrong on military operations. He fucked up. Hundreds if not thousands of Afghan refugees died because of this fuck up. Senior leaders in the Biden administration knows this.
What would have the withdrawal looked like if not botched? Don’t think the Afghans were going to throw bouquets of flowers at our departing troops. We were turning things over to the Taliban after the government had basically collapsed.
Even if we had taken an extra 6 months to withdraw, I still think there would be more casualties during that time also. And things would have still been messy.
Respectfully don’t patronize me with your military smarts. The link shows that there was no plan three months before the pullout date. My guy? I am pointing out actual facts about this. Your record does not give you the right to negate facts. Explain how the withdrawal could have been done more effectively if there were no plans in February, with a pullout in May. Felon Trump didn’t give a rat’s ass about the Afghanistan people, secretly agreeing with the Taliban and excluding the legitimate government. Reducing troop levels to 2,500 soldiers shows contempt for those people when he released 7,000 Taliban fighters. I think it is your guy you are protecting, and he doesn’t deserve your concern.
Wow. Some people can’t take criticism. And don’t confuse my criticism of Biden that I’m defending Trump’s actions. You obviously don’t know me. Trump can be wrong and Biden can still botch a withdrawal. Sorry I don’t agree with you. Send me to a reeducation camp. When did the Bulwark become a place where military veterans who have been involved in redeployment plans can’t criticize a botched withdrawal that resulted in civilian deaths. Ok. You do your thing.
Bush failed at Tora Bora, Obama should have gotten out after they killed Bin Laden, Trump dithered and then negotiated a bad deal to pull out. Biden executed the evacuation badly. Did I miss anyone?
Exactly. Some people can’t admit Biden made an obvious mistake. It’s a very unhealthy way to go through life. It’s one of the annoying things about Trump.
I respect your view, but I don't think that any president, Trump included, could've managed the end days in Afghanistan much better. The collapse of the afghan army reminded me of Saigon in '75 (I was 18) and when there is chaos like that, it would seem to be difficult to manage an orderly withdraw but in either case, I wasn't there.
Respectfully, Biden still botched Afghanistan, and owns that 100%. Yes, the Trump admin negotiated the withdrawal, but Biden was responsible for the proper execution of it. This doesn’t mean Biden was a bad president. I also believe he did an exceptional job pulling NATO together and supporting Ukraine, as well as his leadership supporting Israel after the Oct 7th Hamas terrorist attack.
Agree.
By the numbers, the pullout was eminently successful, not botched.
Pls explain.
Look to Vietnam as a comparison. Over 60 servicemen were killed during the last month of the chaotic withdrawal. It's a miracle that the Afghanistan operation went as well as it did after 20 years of war and Trump's worst negotiated peace deal in history (he released Taliban 5,000 terrorist fighters back to the battlefield).
Thank you. Was this comparison ever made by any media outlet? I didn't follow the news closely. I don't recall hearing anything like this.
I don’t recall hearing anything like that from the media either, and I followed it closely across all media outlets. The media narrative was set on the first day from 15-20 seconds of video at the airport. You know, the clips of people running alongside the plane and packed in a cargo hold that outlets ran over and over.
yes, that is the image associated with the withdrawal
The 13 servicepeople killed by the ISIS-K suicide bomber is a tragedy.
However, by every other number the withdrawal was a great success, not botched or a debacle:
Americans, allies and Afghan refugees evacuated: over 122,000
American serviceperson lives lost to Taliban: 0
American civilian lives lost: 0
American civilians remaining in Afghanistan except by their choice: <50
Number of days by which final August 31 deadline for withdrawal missed: 0
Firefights with Taliban during evacuation: 0
American military deaths before withdrawal and evacuation: 2,402
American military deaths after withdrawal and evacuation to date: 0
thx. why is this news to me?
Because it’s not part of the news media’s narrative.
Of course. Why did I bother to ask? Trump has corrupted the MSM part of our free press.
But, cable and broadcast news is not where most people get their news and their audiences are declining. So CBS’ cave may not matter all that much. The growth of independent news, like the Bulwark, and their social-media-sharing-ready content getting widely shared is a good thing.
Hubby McGee, Biden changed the withdrawal date from May to August to get more people out. When Felon Trump left office he had no logistical plan, none at all, to complete the orderly evacuation of either personnel or equipment within the agreed timeframe. If you would go to white house.gov you may see that Biden’s administration was not given any plans for evacuation because there were none. But the withdrawal date was three months away. Biden did want a September withdrawal date. How do you think the Taliban would have accepted that! 100%? No!
Katherine again, respectfully, no excuse. Biden was president. I'm a retired Army officer. 90 days is plenty of time to plan an effective withdrawal. Respectfully, please don't patronize me with a whitehouse.gov link. I'm a multiple deployed Iraq War vet - and led soldiers down range - and was permanently disabled while preparing for a deployment to Afghanistan. It is unwise to fall into the trap of believing "your guy" can do no wrong on military operations. He fucked up. Hundreds if not thousands of Afghan refugees died because of this fuck up. Senior leaders in the Biden administration knows this.
What would have the withdrawal looked like if not botched? Don’t think the Afghans were going to throw bouquets of flowers at our departing troops. We were turning things over to the Taliban after the government had basically collapsed.
Even if we had taken an extra 6 months to withdraw, I still think there would be more casualties during that time also. And things would have still been messy.
Respectfully don’t patronize me with your military smarts. The link shows that there was no plan three months before the pullout date. My guy? I am pointing out actual facts about this. Your record does not give you the right to negate facts. Explain how the withdrawal could have been done more effectively if there were no plans in February, with a pullout in May. Felon Trump didn’t give a rat’s ass about the Afghanistan people, secretly agreeing with the Taliban and excluding the legitimate government. Reducing troop levels to 2,500 soldiers shows contempt for those people when he released 7,000 Taliban fighters. I think it is your guy you are protecting, and he doesn’t deserve your concern.
Wow. Some people can’t take criticism. And don’t confuse my criticism of Biden that I’m defending Trump’s actions. You obviously don’t know me. Trump can be wrong and Biden can still botch a withdrawal. Sorry I don’t agree with you. Send me to a reeducation camp. When did the Bulwark become a place where military veterans who have been involved in redeployment plans can’t criticize a botched withdrawal that resulted in civilian deaths. Ok. You do your thing.
Bush failed at Tora Bora, Obama should have gotten out after they killed Bin Laden, Trump dithered and then negotiated a bad deal to pull out. Biden executed the evacuation badly. Did I miss anyone?
Exactly. Some people can’t admit Biden made an obvious mistake. It’s a very unhealthy way to go through life. It’s one of the annoying things about Trump.
I respect your view, but I don't think that any president, Trump included, could've managed the end days in Afghanistan much better. The collapse of the afghan army reminded me of Saigon in '75 (I was 18) and when there is chaos like that, it would seem to be difficult to manage an orderly withdraw but in either case, I wasn't there.