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Frank Lee's avatar

The continued fixation on Trump is so interesting from the psychological perspective.

However...

In a speech delivered at a conference in honor of Du Bois at Atlanta University in October 1974 and reprinted in the February 1975 issue of Crisis, Henderson wrote, “If all racial prejudice and discrimination and all racism were erased today, all the ills brought by the process of economic class distinction and economic depression of the masses of black people would remain.”

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Alondra's avatar

Let's get to the all racism erased part, then check back in. ok?

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Frank Lee's avatar

First, you can never "erase " racism as it is tribalism and coastal liberals for example exhibit the most tribalism.

Second, there is not enough material real racism left, except the neoracism of the woke against whites.

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Terry Hilldale's avatar

Stop bringing right-wing propaganda to the Bulwark. You don't see THIS kind of tribalism among liberals, coastal or otherwise: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HmHYuwOoR9A (starting at 1:25). By the way, you didn't seem to get the memo. Since Trump called Mo Brooks "woke", the term has become nothing but a fangless, all-purpose insult MAGA like to fling indiscriminately. (See what I did there).

You are here to bring nothing but bad faith and right wing propaganda.

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Frank Lee's avatar

LOL. So "MAGA" is a cool pejoritive, but "Woke" is just silly old hat.

Woke is the same as neorasit. If you are woke you are infected with a fake scholarship parasitic mind virus. MAGA is awesome... who can say that "Making American Great Again" is a negative goal? However, woke... that is some sicko stuff. People that subscribe to it will be identified and marginalized... rightfully so.

What do you mean by right-wing? You mean those that appose the wokeism movement?

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Terry Hilldale's avatar

MAGA is not a pejorative. MAGA is how adherents to Trumpism self-identify. but you already know that and said as much in your comment. "woke" is intended to be a pejorative, and you confirmed that as well. What is sicko is MAGA adherents taking CPAC to Hungary and listening to Orban tell them that sicko Tucker Carlson should be broadcast 24-7.

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Carol S.'s avatar

Yes, it's interesting that so many GOP politicians still boast of their allegiance to Trump, and the party still puts him at the center of fundraising appeals, and 52 percent of Republicans responding to a poll said that "loyalty" to Trump is very important to them, and a large portion said that continuing to relitigate the 2020 election is very important to them.

From a psychological perspective, it's downright weird.

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Terry Hilldale's avatar

Probably true. Extreme economic disparity is baked into the cake, but we need to start by removing the racism frosting. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hf0amSOuOX0

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Frank Lee's avatar

The second point I should have made is that there is not much real white-perpetrated race bias today. Otherwise we would have whites targeting Asians. What we have is class bias. So solving the economic class disparity solves everything else.

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Liberal Cynic's avatar

"Otherwise we would have whites targeting Asians."

Um, do you not remember this from all the way back in 2021?

https://www.nytimes.com/live/2021/03/17/us/shooting-atlanta-acworth

Solving class disparity would go a long ways. However, it's too bad that the Republican party, despite trying to rebrand itself as the party of the [white] working class, is all in on making class disparity worse. Has been for decades.

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Frank Lee's avatar

It is blacks targeting Asians. Again, it is class bias.

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Liberal Cynic's avatar

Not in the story I linked to you it wasn't.

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Frank Lee's avatar

Wow. You found one story and from the NYT! Try pulling the statistics if you want to make a relevant point... because everyone can find a story.

Backs are highly over represented in violence against Asians. https://www.financegeek.org/chinese/black-on-asian-crime/

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Terry Hilldale's avatar

The idea it was blacks targeting Asians came straight from right-wing propaganda as a way to to shift blame for all the white targeting going on. https://www.brookings.edu/blog/how-we-rise/2021/03/11/why-the-trope-of-black-asian-conflict-in-the-face-of-anti-asian-violence-dismisses-solidarity/ It is not a golf game where the lowest score wins. Besides, your link is out of date. Ever since Trump started calling Covid "the China virus," assaults on Asians (because, you know, they all look alike) skyrocketed. https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/01419870.2020.1839114 more than three-fourths of Asian assault are perpetuated by whites. https://docs.google.com/document/d/19llMUCDHX-hLKru-cnDCq0BirlpNgF07W3f-q0J0ko4/edit Meanwhile, MAGA pastors all over America are foaming at the mouth, making them look more like demons than the Democrats they literally demonize. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HmHYuwOoR9A (from 1:25)

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Arun's avatar

"NYT". So says the guy who relies on a "Finance Geek" article to justify his BS on racism.

Here's another one for you.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wisconsin_Sikh_temple_shooting

There's no organized anti-immigrant black group as you may want to believe. There are however anti-immigrant white nationalists/supremacists who routinely have problems with asians/blacks/latinos/Jews/LGBT/women. Also this is just an evolution for this same group has also had problems in the past with Irish/Germans/Italians etc.

Shame on you for spouting such "divide & conquer" non-sense. Would have asked you to remove your tin-foil hat, but you know exactly what you are attempting here.

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Liberal Cynic's avatar

You said "whites aren't targeting Asians."

I found you a story that shows a white targeting Asians. It was a pretty big story last year. Would you like to amend your statement?

Asians themselves blame Trump and whites for the rise in violence against them:

https://morningconsult.com/2021/04/07/asian-america-racism-discrimination-poll/

https://www.scmp.com/news/world/united-states-canada/article/3151188/many-asian-republicans-blame-trump-not-their-party

https://www.forbes.com/sites/roberthart/2021/03/19/trumps-chinese-virus-tweet-helped-fuel-anti-asian-hate-on-twitter-study-finds/?sh=67be76741a7c

https://www.npr.org/transcripts/1087536315

Ah, but what do Asians know compared to Mr. Finance Geek.

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Frank Lee's avatar

LOL. Sure. That is why Asians are leaving the Democrat party.

You rattle off corporate media links like you cannot do you own research and critical thinking. The data from the article I cited was directly from your beloved government stats. Blacks make up 12% of the population compared to 62.3% white. Yet blacks are responsible for 27.5% of violent incidents against Asians compared to 24.1% whites.

Do you do math?

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Terry Hilldale's avatar

Asians blame Trump's rhetoric for the skyrocketing increase in assaults. They blame Democrats for what they perceive as efforts to weaken their number one priority--education.

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Frank Lee's avatar

Class disparity was shrinking under Trump. Probably explained why Democrats were so committed to defeating him as Democrats need their talking points.

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Frank Lee's avatar

Oh Jesus. See why we cannot have nice things. Fake news and fake "studies" everywhere.

It is widely known and accepted in the real world of non-alternate facts that, under Trump, real working class income relative to inflation moved up relative to the upper class.

Under Trump paychecks grew faster than inflation. Average weekly earnings for all workers were up 8.7% after inflation. Biden has destroyed that.

https://news.yahoo.com/irs-data-prove-trump-tax-130007569.html

https://www.factcheck.org/2019/06/are-wages-rising-or-flat/

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Terry Hilldale's avatar

All the statistics taken together show that income disparity has accelerated. https://www.cbpp.org/research/poverty-and-inequality/a-guide-to-statistics-on-historical-trends-in-income-inequality And once again, Biden does not control inflation. If you want to engage is stupid partisanship finger-pointing, the factors that contributed to inflation began under Trump. It is a bit like braking your car. Even if you floor it, the car won't stop until many feet later. The inflation we are seeing now was predicted during the Trump administration. It was already baked in the cake.

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Frank Lee's avatar

LOL. So we cannot blame Biden (and if we do it is partisan finger pointing), but we can blame Trump for economic performance under Biden? Ha! Maybe it is still Bush's fault? This just keeps proving what Reagan said: "It is not that our liberal friends are ignorant, it is that they know so much that just isn't so."

What was the average price of gas when Trump left office. $2.20. What is the average price of gas today. $4.60. I think you have a lot of nerve or are demonstating a lot of desparation excusing Biden's inflation. It is going to pound Democrats into smithereens in November.

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Terry Hilldale's avatar

You have missed my point entirely, and probably deliberately. My point is Trump is not to blame for inflation either. If he had won a second term, we would still be experiencing the same inflation. I am telling you to stop always seeking to cast blame, and instead learn to objectively analyze at the multivariate factors of any complicated situation.

If voters are stupid enough to vote for Republicans based on gas prices, then America will deserve the autocracy the GOP is promising. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K-vHQnQ_x5Y

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Frank Lee's avatar

"If he had won a second term, we would still be experiencing the same inflation."

No because he would have vetoed the $2+ tillion in Democrat spending.

Even the Fed says that government spending cause the level of inflation we are seeing. https://www.frbsf.org/economic-research/publications/economic-letter/2022/march/why-is-us-inflation-higher-than-in-other-countries/

He would not have canceled all the oil drilling permits. He would have pushed back on the continued King Fauci shutdown and mandates... that by the way never worked and causes more harm.

We might have had some inflation, but not this level.

This is just excuse-making whataboutism. You love old Biden and hate old Trump and so you will keep making excuses for Biden and blame Trump for your hangnail.

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Liberal Cynic's avatar

Man, Biden's inflation really sucks for the British, French, Canadians, Brazilians, Australians, Indians and everyone else on the planet also experiencing inflation and high gas prices right now.

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Frank Lee's avatar

Nowhere near what we are experiencing in the US. And US policies that cause domenstic inflation impacts the inflation of these other countries.

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Liberal Cynic's avatar

One paycheck stat is not sufficiently indicative of a wider non-inequality trend.

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TW Falcon's avatar

Hey, Kevin... it's probably not worth arguing with a social misfit.

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