I, too, noticed that the NYT did not mince words when reporting on Trumps rant about Somali’s. I felt relieved to see this as a top headline and bigotry and nativism labeled specifically and accurately.
The Times has been bolder about telling it like it is in many cases. Unfortunately, some editors are apparently not onboard for fights with the administration, because you'll have an article like the one on the Somalis followed by one where they still shade their criticism.
I would urge caution about this Somali situation. Trump of course is an a-hole and overreacts. But as someone who lived in Minnesota for quite a while and still visits on occasion, there are some legit problems with the situation there. Trump was lying about Haitians eating cats and dogs and that was despicable. But a large influx of immigrants into a town like Springfield does have real ramifications, and as we saw -- voters in Ohio chose Trump in the debate when Dems failed to acknowledge the concerns that were true in their lives. Likewise, I do think the Somali effort may have some support in Minnesota, despite Trump's bluster and ill-intent. Gov. Walz is landing on the wrong side of a welfare fraud scandal in the Somali community. There are some real problems with crime and cultural integration there that cross the political spectrum. So while we should correctly condemn Trump's bigotry and falsehoods, I wouldn't say this is a nothing-burger being blown out of proportion. We'll see how it evolves, but I wouldn't rule out this getting a somewhat warm welcome in Minnesota. And even some on the left who won't say it out loud might have some quiet support for pushback.
I was early in my teaching career when in an unusual spate of self reflection and guiltp the US admitted Vietnamese Amerasians whose fathers were GIs (and rightfully I think to admit them).They are a bit different from Somali refugees, but they had let’s say problems adjusting, and by problems I mean they didn’t come to school. When we went for a visit to the apartment complex where many had been resettled, we found large numbers hanging out in the courtyard and smoking cigarettes. The “kids” were mostly in their late teens early 20s, but the government in its wisdom thought foisting them upon public high schools would be a good idea. I think of those kids sometimes. The majority never came to school, and I doubt they worked. They were deeply traumatized, loathed in their home country and by their mothers, mostly living on the streets in Saigon before coming here. Many of the Somalis probably were also traumatized after a generation of civil war. Immigration is enormously complicated. I was on the front lines of it for 25 years and boy is there nuance.
Going after bad actors, be they from the Somali community or elsewhere, is totally legit and necessary. Berating and threatening an entire population of Americans and immigrants, based on the actions of only a few, is not ok. This is the same Trump/Miller playbook we are seeing play out re the Afghan refugees/emigrees.
Kevin do you think fraud of this kind is limited to Minnesota and Somalis, because I doubt it. There are always problems with large groups of immigrants, but there are also usually benefits. One thing I suspect is that immigrants get punished, by the people who want them to come in the first place. They are vulnerable, they get exploited, with undocumented the problem is at its worst nobody ever punished the companies that knowingly employ and exploit them. Another problem is that the Somalis being referred to have been here a long time and a majority are US citizens. I am not going to defend Omar, who I find to be a bigot, but the people who chose her as their representative deserve to be represented, the job is to convince them to follow a better path.
Certainly fraud goes beyond this situation. But there does seem to be a disproportionate amount in this case, just observing anecdotally. This isn't the first major scandal involving large scale fraud in the Somali community in Minnesota. There is a parallel with the Twin Cities having taken in a large number of Hmong refugees as well over the years. Of course the fringe supremacists probably have issues with them as well, but largely, that population has integrated well into Minnesota and they haven't had many issues there. Likewise with lots of Hispanic immigrants in recent years, and a growing Indian diaspora community there. Other than typical friction, those seem to going fairly well with minimal problems.
I'm not sure where this goes and as you say, I suspect most in the community are here legally. So I'm not sure what the recourse is for the situation MN finds itself in. I'm just saying there is and has been (even prior to Trump 1) a level of concern in Minnesota about the situation that seems unique and real which is hard to understand in a national discussion unless you're locally familiar with it.
At this point you'd have to show me detailed and compelling evidence that the disproportionate amount being perceived is actual reality rather than disproportionate coverage because ignorant, racist America likes to hear when immigrants and minorities commit crimes but shrugs their shoulders when white people do the same. The burden of proof is on the ignorant racists these days, not the immigrants and minorities as far as I'm concerned.
And if that attitude prompts people to vote for Trump then good. They and this country deserve everything they'll get from that choice. I'm done humoring that shit in the hopes people come around. They can get shipped to fight Trump's coming war in Venezuela.
Please see the comment below from Peabody Jones with a link to a good article in the NYT.
A brief excerpt:
“American society and the denizens of the state of Minnesota have been extremely good to Somalis,” said Dr. Samatar, who is Somali American.
Dr. Samatar said that Somali refugees who came to the United States after their country’s civil war were raised in a culture in which stealing from the country’s dysfunctional and corrupt government was widespread.
Minnesota, he said, proved susceptible to rampant fraud because it is “so tolerant, so open and so geared toward keeping an eye on the weak.”
I saw it earlier in the holidays. It is clear it was a large problem within the chosen frame of Minnesota during this specific time period. My point is that chosen frame is suspect until it is exhaustively proven not to be as far as I'm concerned. Especially when the person trumpeting the whole thing is a pedo, rapist who accepts bribes every week and is likely using tariff manipulation to line his pockets.
Not that the people who committed the fraud shouldn't be prosecuted, they should.
I looked up statewide, around 83 % have become citizens, others are now
on the way. many fly back and forth ( $ ) some have other reasons.
I simply know the female girls are still being mutilated, genitalia, it's something we should all be aware of. A reason why all the adult women ' seem'
belligerent or pushy in the stores, it's the only place they have ' power ' . sad
I do wish Ilhan would mention female mutilation as a benefit of living in America. When I lived in the uk this became a big issue as the practice was illegal and went on covertly. Sometimes young girls were taken on vacation out of the country other times rogue professionals did it at home. I am not saying Ilhan lies just that she is louder on some issues. I do think that any one who is elected should be respected for representing their community and not to do so is vile.
It is sad. I just did some quick Googling -- a flight alone for one person round trip from Minneapolis to Mogadishu is $2000-$4000. Multiply that times a full family. That's a lot of money. And in reality, it's likely many of those flights were paid for with taxpayer dollars from the fraud.....just so that young girls can be put through what you describe. That seems like something people might be concerned about.
not sure, but I think only the males get this ' travel ' what it is for, I have no clue. I agree the rampant stomach-churning fraud, wasteful, horrific.
I've heard they can get these procedures on young females from physicians, in an office not of their own, so they lease and do a few. It's done here, all over, they do not have like fly to New York or Detroit/Lansing, the children get viewed, scrutinized and then they just get it done, to them it's a normal part of life. I, at one point I was in mgt ( a short stint ) and would witness several young brides, some like 17, most grooms also fairly young, knowing they had the prep for living ' under a man ' so they were ready, made me so sad.
all it takes is a sharp knife and some know-how, In the UK they have tried to stop it, does not stop it, they are simply more covert. The trips back are maybe burying someone - religious ceremony, OR bringing them money. ?? female-subservient. Several other customs also. A hotel signs an agreement to use a special pan ( that has never cooked pork ??) and they feast on salad and
a creamy mac & cheese. Not sure who is fooling who with that whole deal.
The women of age are so very happy to see the young girls submit.
It happens right in my smaller city, that mutilation, like a traveling nurse or
elder. They are strong believers in vaginal orgasms only, keeps the
men secure in their manhood, women = less relevant or something. I have heard the men put the loan for an auto in the wives' name to protect their own credit rating and privacy. There are printed books all about customs, beliefs. The first young somali female I ever spoke with did not wear a hijab part of her shift, and her cousin likewise, they had wealth, also they did not
need to marry young, arranged secure marriages for them, they were light-hearted, so I did some research, they were most likely cut very young,
Ilhan has so many sides, but I do have some faith she is attempting to direct the population into more ' modern times ' . I sure hope so, Ms Omar has been attacked not only by Trump for a long, long time. Her methods may be what
In Springfield, Ohio, the local Republican politicians said the Haitian immigrants were positive. All immigrants have real ramifications. When the Irish and Germans first arrived, they were considered dirt. Chinese were felt to be so bad that the first anti immigration laws targeted the Chinese. The 1924 anti immigration laws were targeted against the primitive Italians, Jews, and East Europeans. JFK had to justify that he was not a puppet of the Pope. Look in the mirror, and more likely than not, your ancestors were despised by the “real Americans “.
Of course, we should expose Pete Hegseth's role in ordering the military to commit a war crime. But this isn't the whole issue, or maybe even the most important one.
Over the last few days and weeks, we have heard a lot about the professionalism of our military, how they are thoroughly trained in what constitutes an illegal order, and that they are a bastion against an authoritarian government. Well, I've always thought the military was pretty Trumpy. Military veterans voted for Trump by large margins. And when they were faced with an obviously illegal order to blatantly commit a war crime, it took about 2 seconds for them to say, "Yes SIR! We will KILL those people! Yes SIR!" After everyone, up and down the chain of command, had been trained not to.
So much for the professionalism and moral fiber of our military.
I do imagine it’s pretty tough to question the SECDEF (Sukwar) in the heat of the moment - not defending such decision (s), but acknowledging whether people with 20-30-more years of their lives invested in a military career would pick a fight w/him in the moment- the ‘fog of war’, as our esteemed Sukwar stated at the podium…
There is no heat of the moment here. The "fog of war" is a BS argument. The officers weren't getting shot at. They were sitting comfortably in their offices staring at computer screens. Nobody was getting shot at, except for the people in the boat. They were sitting in the middle of the ocean. They couldn't run anywhere. Nobody was coming to their defense. We had hours (at least) to decide what to do, and nobody in our military was in any physical danger at any time.
You are correct that resisting an illegal order could ruin a career. That is the point. The military will cave to this kind of pressure, just like the law firms and university presidents. Probably even faster and with less pushback. Right now, that means that people in boats, who may or may not have done anything wrong, can be killed at Pete Hegseth's whim. This was a test, and the military failed. Suppose that Trump doesn't like the result of a future election, and he orders the military to occupy congress and arrest the Democrats. Now we see that they will just follow orders.
I agree with every word you have written. I was not supporting Sukwar’s argument. But if you are in that room, and your boss (the admiral) gives you an order, you already know that disobeying that order is a trip to prison. You may or may not believe you will eventually (read: in months or years) be vindicated and released. But you know in the moment, you’re going to the brig, and then to jail, likely somewhere like Leavenworth. It is the reality those underlings are well aware of. So unless one of those people has the spine to say, “No Sir” to a highly decorated Senior Officer, they’re going to follow orders, get through their tour of duty, and develop a serious substance abuse problem. It could be years before any of them is willing to give up the goods on their boss.
Is it actually a conundrum? I think it's pretty clear what they are supposed to do. The problem is that we expect them to do things that are really hard. I read Hertling's article, and I was annoyed that we couldn't comment on it. He seems to think that military training is so rigorous and their sense of honor and duty is so strong that they will do the hard thing in the moment of truth. The evidence for that is pretty slim. People take oaths all the time and then don't live up to them. It's no different in the military. Their sense of loyalty to their comrades seems very similar to what you see in law enforcement. We see police cover up and lie for each other all the time. Why would we expect anything different in the military?
Our soldiers in Vietnam committed numerous atrocities. Horrific examples were revealed, sometimes, sort of, after a lot of digging. The deep disappointment is that 5 decades of an all-volunteer force were supposed to give us a military that was much more professional, with soldiers who really did rise above with their commitment, honor, and sense of duty. Now, when we really need them, in their first real test in Trump2, they failed.
I eye rolled that "fog of war" comment. Fog of War applies BEFORE -- "how many guys are on the other side of that hill" -- or AFTER -- "how much damage did the air strike really do? -- but DURING? Not really. They saw the ship blow up. They watched. They saw survivors struggling in the water.
Hegseth talks about all the Washington Press Corps guys who "sit in air conditioned offices" passing judgement on the "war fighters." Okay, Pete. How many people involved in that strike WEREN'T sitting in an air conditioned office when it happened?
That's right: all of them. Sipping coffee. Watching monitors. Watching what was going on. All the options available to them. Senior, experienced people there with the luxury of deciding next moves. And they picked one.
This wasn't some E-2 who hadn't slept for two days slogging through the muck in some god-forsaken hellhole who has to decide if he's going to chuck the grenade into a building, not knowing if there are civilians inside or not. These are senior level officers, people with decades of experience, surrounded by their staffs, in AN AIR CONDITIONED ROOM, with all the time in the world. So something (pick one of many options) or do nothing. All on the table.
I spent my entire career with the US Army in one form or another - active duty, contractor and government civilian. Most of my service was during the Cold War but I also did a 6-month deployment to Afghanistan as an Army civilian. The vast majority of men and women I served with were dedicated and decent individuals. I never met a single stereotype that you see so often in the movies. People are complex - I would bet my last dollar that those 82nd Airborne Soldiers who cheered Trump at Fort Bragg would be the first ones to rescue someone from an accident or who was being threatened by thugs. I am angered and dismayed at the compliance of the senior military to Trump policies, but you have to understand that subservience to civilian and military authority is deeply embedded in military culture. You do not make to a senior position in the military by being a rebel. We human beings are also great at rationalizing our behavior - no doubt that many senior leaders believe that by going along with "small" things, they can stop the worst things from happening. That does not excuse or justify the actions that our military is taking off the coast off the coast of Venezuela. There needs to be an investigation and accountability for the actions by those involved. Meanwhile, we all need to speak out against the unlawful use of the military, to include the occupation of our cities.
Sorry, those 82nd Airborne troops were wrong in cheering him like they did. Disgusting display. It was a purely political event. The Senior NCO's should have stood in the door over it. They didn't. The esteem I used to hold for that unit took a fatal round that day. If they were forced to attend they could have remained silent. I have respect for those troops who were forced to march in trump's birthday parade. They shuffled along in non-military imprecision as a silent protest against being used for personal and political purposes. They made the parade look as stupid as they (correctly) thought it was.
I think (always dangerous) that I read a piece that the soldiers appearing right behind the dear leader, cheering him on, were chosen for that propaganda picture and non-dear leader supporters were culled out of the joyous gathering….do I have that right? If so, I wonder what glorious duties the non supporters were awarded. Latrine scrubbing, anyone?
Yes, those 82nd Airborne troops were absolutely wrong to cheer Trump's political comments. And I blame their leaders even more - for not making it clear to them in advance what their proper conduct should have been. And if those leaders did not counsel those Soldiers afterwards, then shame on them for again failing their responsibilities of leadership. However, the point I was making is that people are complex and you cannot define them by a single instance of behavior or even their political views. For example, as a government civilian, I worked with a retired Army Sergeant Major who had very different political views from me, but he was one of the best people I ever worked with; I could always count on him (in my experience, people that you can count on are worth their weight in gold). All the Republican poll workers that I served with during the last election in my county were every bit as dedicated and helpful as the Democratic poll workers were. And like I said, if I were in an accident, or threatened in a dark alley, I would have no doubt that if there were Soldiers from the 82nd Airborne nearby, they would do something to help me.
Sorry to “double dip”, but since reading your comment I couldn’t stop thinking about it. I share some similar experience. I joined the USMC in 1975 - shortly prior to formal cessation of hostilities with N Vietnam. In early ‘76 I found myself assigned to USMC 3rd Marine Air Wing HQ on the island of Okinawa, Japan in a group w/4 senior officers, about a dozen Senior NCO’s, and one other junior enlisted PFC & me. Needless to say all but me and the other PFC had served at least a couple of tours in Vietnam. Several had also served combat tours in Korea in the 50’s. As you noted, these men were also complicated individuals, but the finest mentors a kid like me could have had. Did I agree with what they had to offer on numerous and various subjects? Hell No! But were they men of dignity and honor? Absolutely. These were hard human beings - but I learned an awful lot about life from them. Fifty years later I still have a picture in my mind of every one of them. And I am grateful for every difficult lesson I learned from them. Thanks Kurt, for reminding me of all of those with whom I served.
Thank you Timothy, for your comments and what you shared about your time in the Marines (The Bulwark Community is the best). My father was in the 1st Marine Division during the Korean War (an Army historian wrote that the 1stMarDiv in the Chosin Reservoir Campaign was one of the greatest military units in American history - you can imagine how proud that makes me). Folks who serve in the military are regular human beings, with the same flaws as everyone else. I think what sets active duty/vets apart is that no matter why they went into the military, they learn to serve and care about something more important than themselves (even if it is just their fellow squad members). Most vets I have been around have a strong belief in the value of service. It disturbs me when I see military folks supporting Trump, but I try hard not to judge them - I have done many stupid, immature and selfish things in my life and I hope that those things don't define the totality of who I am. And yes, I didn't appreciate how much I learned in the Army until I left it. Right now, I think it is critical that vets speak out and be as active as they can in opposing this administration. Thanks again for your comments!
Unless he can’t read and never trained as a Navy officer, Admiral Bradley had to know he was being given an illegal order. Not even a fog machine blowing in his office or a Secretary of Defense blowing smoke could obscure what the admiral had to know. So, with that in mind, have a look at the jobs site of your choice and tell me how many listings you find for an experienced former admiral. None? Really? Hmmm. I wonder if Admiral Bradley knows that? You think? And do you think he knows what would happen to him if he failed to follow orders? Or if he spoke out about illegal orders? A court martial? Prison time? Does Admiral Bradley have a family, kids in school, a wife looking forward to his retirement? I don’t know anything about the man. But I feel deeply for him—and for every other uniformed officer in the U.S. military, serving at the pleasure of the sickest, cruelest, most demented and deranged man ever to be elected president of the United States.
Right. Ask the people who served in Iraq and Afghanistan whether “the land is easier”. We are literally animals that live on land. Naval and air superiority are easy with our technology.
Considering about half of Venezuela is covered in forests and jungle, especially in their mountainous regions, ask someone who slogged up and down the Central Highlands of Vietnam how "Land is easier". Of course Donnie Draft Dodger wouldn't know.
You're forgetting that trump knows more about war than all the generals and admirals. In fact, no one in history has ever known more about war than trump. So if he says "the land is easier," it must be true!! After all, it had to be on land that he won his bone spurs.
I've given up hope that Trump will face any justice. He's already too old and addled and in a year or two he may be alive but beyond reach. These other people though . . . they must face real consequences for their crimes
This. So much this. I could care less aboit getting Trump impeached (again), and the SC ensured he'll face no legal ramifications for his actions. The underlings though? At the very least impeach them.
It was so sad watching Little Marco doing all that enthusiastic asskissing while Trump just slept through it. I suppose he probably caught it on Jimmy Kimmel, tho.
"But of course Hegseth would presumably still have been reachable after he left the room, by secure phone—or on Signal!—to discuss that second decision."
Good one, Bill! I'd nearly forgotten about Signal Gate. The amount of insanity is overwhelming.
Cheap Shots: Petey is both - incompetent and a liar. Just like everyone else who works in POS's administration.
Nice to see even the loons seem to care about starting Mr. no-wars president starting one with Venezuela or Mexico or whatever. Speaking of which, when are the Rs going to figure out that putting troops into Venezuela is just as bad as Hitler invading Poland, or Putin invading Ukraine?
Even when dear leader sleeps we need to maintain the obsequiousness as you never know who may tattle when he wakes, or if he will want to view the footage to reassure himself his pets were appropriately deferential. The depths we’ve sunk to, where Democrats last year threw sleepy Joe Biden overboard and now we have sleeping Donald Trump, and the GOP chorus responds by continuing the soundtrack.
Right now she's running for NY governor. She may be done with federal level politics for now but she is worried that her records as a House member might be subject to subpoena. What was she doing on Jan 6 and thereafter?
If Ilhan Omar is—in Trump’s words—garbage (which anyone with his eyes open can see she is clearly not), what is Trump? Garbage+? An offshoot of the USA Network to which we have all been forcibly subscribed? Twenty-four-7 programming starring a grotesque foul-mouthed lump of a man on a mission to turn the United States of America into a shithole country? Trump says the U.S. is at a tipping point. I disagree. I think we are at a turning point. I think one American household after another is turning off the Trump channel, turning away from the endless scandals and coverups and lies and chaos and corruption of the Trump administration, turning away from garbage+.
Watching this “briefing” felt like witnessing a nation extinguish itself one filament at a time. Not the mercy of a sudden blackout. A slow, surgical dimming. A deliberate throttling of civic oxygen. Question by non-question. The light receded with every obsequious nod, every pre-chewed provocation masquerading as inquiry, every hollow-boned influencer mistaking proximity to power for the burden of truth, and in that feverish half-glow, you could feel the tectonic shift.
The Pentagon wasn’t addressing a republic, or a public, or anything resembling a nation of thinking beings. It was whispering to its own reflection. The briefing room had become a gilded hall of mirrors, no scrutiny, just self-admiration arranged in a circle.
That mirror doesn’t simply reflect a captured institution or a vandalized chain of command. It reflects us. The whole malignant tableau, the sycophants with PRESS badges dangling like stolen credentials, the spokesperson reciting state-sanctioned delusion as though language itself had conceded defeat, the engineered silence where accountability once lived, none of it exists in a vacuum. It exists because the country built the vacuum willingly.
This government isn’t an aberration. It’s an x-ray.
Every word uttered from that podium, every lie allowed to stand unmolested, every war crime wrapped in patriotic cellophane, each is a diagnostic image of the national psyche. Not the aspirational America etched into marble and myth, but the America that tolerated this, normalized this, voted for this. The America that long ago traded civic rigor for emotional anesthesia. The America that insists it is better than this even as it sinks, knee-deep and unblinking, into its own moral sediment.
In the end, the Pentagon didn’t speak to the nation. It spoke to the mirror, and the mirror, with pitiless clarity, spoke back.
Ironically, Trump understands that a brand, like the USA or Trump rely on good will as an essential element of their brands value.
Yet, he appears to be doing everything in his power to destroy all of the good will this nation has earned over the years.; through USAID and immigration.
Couple this with his illegal and unconstitutional extrajudicial murders, and by the time he leaves office, the world will believe we’re worse than Putin and Russia.
A high bar, but Trump's working it. I wonder if the world doesn't already think we're worse. Putin does offer a certain consistency that we can't match right now.
Might this not be the objective, though? Disassociate the U.S. from the "weakling" and "woke" countries that do the democracy and human rights stuff and emerge with a new identity as global mob boss?
Steve, is there any doubt that this regime is determined to be seen as the scary and unpredictable mob boss to the world?
The deliberate destruction of soft power and longstanding alliances of mutual respect and trust will take generations to rebuild, if it's even possible.
They've already cut back on intelligence sharing with us. It will only be a matter of time (if they're not doing it already) when our former allies are feeding us misinformation to find out which enemies we're in bed with.
It’s going to take years to realign their defense without our support, but in the meantime, they know we are not trustworthy and will behave differently towards us in many ways. I fear greatly for our children and wonder what might happen in the event of some questionable military adventure by this administration - will our ‘allies’ support us? Will our ‘enemies’ undermine us? Just who are our ‘allies’ today? The Saudi’s? The Qutaris? The Russians? As the old farmers in my native rural NH would often say, ‘hard tellin’, not knowin’….
They've already cut back on intelligence sharing with us.”
Agreed, and that’s just the start. Canada just bought a 72 Saab JAS 39 Griper’s, replacing the F-35 from Lockheed Martin.
And most of Europe is following suit. They aren’t buying US anymore; they’re rebuilding their own Military Industrial Complex (MIC), since America can’t be trusted, especially when it comes to Trump and defending Article 5 of NATO.
Only now is the MIC finally waking the F**k Up and realizing their future NATO orders aren’t going to materialize. It’s about time these useless invertebrates grew a spine, although it may be too late.
That said, European Airlines are also starting to buy more Airbus’s, instead of Boeing, Lockheed Martin and other big manufacturers of Commercial Aircraft….:)
So the orange narcissist-felon and his carefully coifed secretary of defense have thrown the admiral under the bus. But it is possible--long shot--that the admiral will restate and provide in evidence (tomorrow) the order he was given, in the presence of witnesses, to 'kill them all.'
Meantime, the actual perpetrators, the chain of command below him, may recall Mark Kelly's clear words of warning. They are now in the direct line of legal fire, along with their admiral.
The word 'accountability,' evaded so long and so successfully by the orange narcissist-felon and his creepy cult-regime sycophants, may eventually happen.
"'Tis a consummation devoutly to be wished" (Hamlet).
The problem is that the Admiral should not have obeyed or passed down the order. Period. End of story.
The fact that he did so, despite whatever paper trail he provides implicating Hesgeth, is immaterial. We hanged people after WW2 for just following the wrong types of orders
Part of the Admiral's job/duty/responsibilities is to NOT obey or pass down such orders.
That is the other thing, all of the officers below him are also culpable. Each had the duty to refuse the order as it came down--so by passing the order down he screwed over all those below him.
The only people who really have an out in that kind of situation are enlisted personnel--and even they would face jeopardy.
agree but we will never know the full circumstances. The Admiral may have been given classified information that made him believe it was necessary to kill everyone. Hell maybe those fishermen were Al Qaida including the real Osama. We will never know!
I've never served, but I'd imagine that to make admiral one has to be really good at CYA and palace intrigue. I have to guess that the Admiral has a very long and complete paper trail.
My intention is to use that ridiculous insulting title as a pejorative term. It probably doesn't come across that way, but that's what's going on when I type. 😀
Here’s the issue: I have no idea what’s in a man’s heart. either the admiral is going to back Sukwar Hegseth & Trump to the hilt- knowing Trump will take care of him and scaring the shit out of every single uniformed human being beneath him to STFU and follow his lead - or he’s going to turn on Sukwar and Trump and lay down on a grenade. I know a little about this guy. But I don’t know what’s in his heart. He might not know the answer himself.
I don't think people appreciate how much Republicans *hate* the United States as it exists today. They despise the idea of a culturally diverse, socially tolerant nation.
Senator Paul omitted the likeliest possibility: that the administration is both lying and incompetent.
Yup, I’ll go with both; good call…:)
I’d go a step further unifying to two: they are incompetent liars.
For once Paul has a good point. And that sharp point isn't just above his shoulders.
And most importantly, the whole bunch of them are DOOMED!!
You support Trump you’re either an asshole, dipshit or both. No other choices
I, too, noticed that the NYT did not mince words when reporting on Trumps rant about Somali’s. I felt relieved to see this as a top headline and bigotry and nativism labeled specifically and accurately.
The Times has been bolder about telling it like it is in many cases. Unfortunately, some editors are apparently not onboard for fights with the administration, because you'll have an article like the one on the Somalis followed by one where they still shade their criticism.
I agree. The Times' ongoing sanewashing of Trump is driving me crazy, but every once in while they manage to cover him forthrightly.
And here is a GIFT link to the article JH mentioned above. Anyone can read it for free:
https://www.nytimes.com/2025/12/02/us/politics/trump-somalia.html?unlocked_article_code=1.508.AF1e.QlcQHEGUduvf&smid=url-share
I would urge caution about this Somali situation. Trump of course is an a-hole and overreacts. But as someone who lived in Minnesota for quite a while and still visits on occasion, there are some legit problems with the situation there. Trump was lying about Haitians eating cats and dogs and that was despicable. But a large influx of immigrants into a town like Springfield does have real ramifications, and as we saw -- voters in Ohio chose Trump in the debate when Dems failed to acknowledge the concerns that were true in their lives. Likewise, I do think the Somali effort may have some support in Minnesota, despite Trump's bluster and ill-intent. Gov. Walz is landing on the wrong side of a welfare fraud scandal in the Somali community. There are some real problems with crime and cultural integration there that cross the political spectrum. So while we should correctly condemn Trump's bigotry and falsehoods, I wouldn't say this is a nothing-burger being blown out of proportion. We'll see how it evolves, but I wouldn't rule out this getting a somewhat warm welcome in Minnesota. And even some on the left who won't say it out loud might have some quiet support for pushback.
While there may indeed be legitimate problems, Trump is once again targeting dark skinned people for cynical political reasons.
I hope that the local community can resolve these problems.
I was early in my teaching career when in an unusual spate of self reflection and guiltp the US admitted Vietnamese Amerasians whose fathers were GIs (and rightfully I think to admit them).They are a bit different from Somali refugees, but they had let’s say problems adjusting, and by problems I mean they didn’t come to school. When we went for a visit to the apartment complex where many had been resettled, we found large numbers hanging out in the courtyard and smoking cigarettes. The “kids” were mostly in their late teens early 20s, but the government in its wisdom thought foisting them upon public high schools would be a good idea. I think of those kids sometimes. The majority never came to school, and I doubt they worked. They were deeply traumatized, loathed in their home country and by their mothers, mostly living on the streets in Saigon before coming here. Many of the Somalis probably were also traumatized after a generation of civil war. Immigration is enormously complicated. I was on the front lines of it for 25 years and boy is there nuance.
Going after bad actors, be they from the Somali community or elsewhere, is totally legit and necessary. Berating and threatening an entire population of Americans and immigrants, based on the actions of only a few, is not ok. This is the same Trump/Miller playbook we are seeing play out re the Afghan refugees/emigrees.
Kevin do you think fraud of this kind is limited to Minnesota and Somalis, because I doubt it. There are always problems with large groups of immigrants, but there are also usually benefits. One thing I suspect is that immigrants get punished, by the people who want them to come in the first place. They are vulnerable, they get exploited, with undocumented the problem is at its worst nobody ever punished the companies that knowingly employ and exploit them. Another problem is that the Somalis being referred to have been here a long time and a majority are US citizens. I am not going to defend Omar, who I find to be a bigot, but the people who chose her as their representative deserve to be represented, the job is to convince them to follow a better path.
Certainly fraud goes beyond this situation. But there does seem to be a disproportionate amount in this case, just observing anecdotally. This isn't the first major scandal involving large scale fraud in the Somali community in Minnesota. There is a parallel with the Twin Cities having taken in a large number of Hmong refugees as well over the years. Of course the fringe supremacists probably have issues with them as well, but largely, that population has integrated well into Minnesota and they haven't had many issues there. Likewise with lots of Hispanic immigrants in recent years, and a growing Indian diaspora community there. Other than typical friction, those seem to going fairly well with minimal problems.
I'm not sure where this goes and as you say, I suspect most in the community are here legally. So I'm not sure what the recourse is for the situation MN finds itself in. I'm just saying there is and has been (even prior to Trump 1) a level of concern in Minnesota about the situation that seems unique and real which is hard to understand in a national discussion unless you're locally familiar with it.
At this point you'd have to show me detailed and compelling evidence that the disproportionate amount being perceived is actual reality rather than disproportionate coverage because ignorant, racist America likes to hear when immigrants and minorities commit crimes but shrugs their shoulders when white people do the same. The burden of proof is on the ignorant racists these days, not the immigrants and minorities as far as I'm concerned.
And if that attitude prompts people to vote for Trump then good. They and this country deserve everything they'll get from that choice. I'm done humoring that shit in the hopes people come around. They can get shipped to fight Trump's coming war in Venezuela.
Please see the comment below from Peabody Jones with a link to a good article in the NYT.
A brief excerpt:
“American society and the denizens of the state of Minnesota have been extremely good to Somalis,” said Dr. Samatar, who is Somali American.
Dr. Samatar said that Somali refugees who came to the United States after their country’s civil war were raised in a culture in which stealing from the country’s dysfunctional and corrupt government was widespread.
Minnesota, he said, proved susceptible to rampant fraud because it is “so tolerant, so open and so geared toward keeping an eye on the weak.”
I saw it earlier in the holidays. It is clear it was a large problem within the chosen frame of Minnesota during this specific time period. My point is that chosen frame is suspect until it is exhaustively proven not to be as far as I'm concerned. Especially when the person trumpeting the whole thing is a pedo, rapist who accepts bribes every week and is likely using tariff manipulation to line his pockets.
Not that the people who committed the fraud shouldn't be prosecuted, they should.
I looked up statewide, around 83 % have become citizens, others are now
on the way. many fly back and forth ( $ ) some have other reasons.
I simply know the female girls are still being mutilated, genitalia, it's something we should all be aware of. A reason why all the adult women ' seem'
belligerent or pushy in the stores, it's the only place they have ' power ' . sad
I do wish Ilhan would mention female mutilation as a benefit of living in America. When I lived in the uk this became a big issue as the practice was illegal and went on covertly. Sometimes young girls were taken on vacation out of the country other times rogue professionals did it at home. I am not saying Ilhan lies just that she is louder on some issues. I do think that any one who is elected should be respected for representing their community and not to do so is vile.
Just had a thought, I'm not Morman or whatever they use
latter day something, neither parent was Catholic
just fertile Scandinavians.
My opinion, she maybe does, not PUBLICLY
It is sad. I just did some quick Googling -- a flight alone for one person round trip from Minneapolis to Mogadishu is $2000-$4000. Multiply that times a full family. That's a lot of money. And in reality, it's likely many of those flights were paid for with taxpayer dollars from the fraud.....just so that young girls can be put through what you describe. That seems like something people might be concerned about.
Myself, I had nine female siblings, plus the males, also I sort of acquired-legally
an additional eight step-siblings for nine years, they were young.
six of them were/are female. I've always cared deeply for all young females.
Long for them to have personal power, self worth and perhaps be somewhat assertive, in a balanced manner. so, yeah it bothers me..
not sure, but I think only the males get this ' travel ' what it is for, I have no clue. I agree the rampant stomach-churning fraud, wasteful, horrific.
I've heard they can get these procedures on young females from physicians, in an office not of their own, so they lease and do a few. It's done here, all over, they do not have like fly to New York or Detroit/Lansing, the children get viewed, scrutinized and then they just get it done, to them it's a normal part of life. I, at one point I was in mgt ( a short stint ) and would witness several young brides, some like 17, most grooms also fairly young, knowing they had the prep for living ' under a man ' so they were ready, made me so sad.
all it takes is a sharp knife and some know-how, In the UK they have tried to stop it, does not stop it, they are simply more covert. The trips back are maybe burying someone - religious ceremony, OR bringing them money. ?? female-subservient. Several other customs also. A hotel signs an agreement to use a special pan ( that has never cooked pork ??) and they feast on salad and
a creamy mac & cheese. Not sure who is fooling who with that whole deal.
The women of age are so very happy to see the young girls submit.
It happens right in my smaller city, that mutilation, like a traveling nurse or
elder. They are strong believers in vaginal orgasms only, keeps the
men secure in their manhood, women = less relevant or something. I have heard the men put the loan for an auto in the wives' name to protect their own credit rating and privacy. There are printed books all about customs, beliefs. The first young somali female I ever spoke with did not wear a hijab part of her shift, and her cousin likewise, they had wealth, also they did not
need to marry young, arranged secure marriages for them, they were light-hearted, so I did some research, they were most likely cut very young,
eight nine years of age. It will never stop.
Covid, it began under ' covid guilt' and handouts, think of the PPP loans
handed out and forgiven, the feeding children fraud was a well planned out awful crime. Maybe they took advantage of covid-guilt. they stole,
and kept on stealing. Others were also stealing, just not in the millions.
Ilhan has so many sides, but I do have some faith she is attempting to direct the population into more ' modern times ' . I sure hope so, Ms Omar has been attacked not only by Trump for a long, long time. Her methods may be what
may work, I find her with flaws, multiple flaws.
Here is a GIFT link to a NYTimes article regarding the Somali fraud situation in Minnesota. Anyone can read it without a subscription:
https://www.nytimes.com/2025/11/29/us/fraud-minnesota-somali.html?unlocked_article_code=1.508.IxSU.pOMhwyM2zghY&smid=url-share
In Springfield, Ohio, the local Republican politicians said the Haitian immigrants were positive. All immigrants have real ramifications. When the Irish and Germans first arrived, they were considered dirt. Chinese were felt to be so bad that the first anti immigration laws targeted the Chinese. The 1924 anti immigration laws were targeted against the primitive Italians, Jews, and East Europeans. JFK had to justify that he was not a puppet of the Pope. Look in the mirror, and more likely than not, your ancestors were despised by the “real Americans “.
It is almost like the NYT is beginning to see reality, although they are still partially asleep.
Of course, we should expose Pete Hegseth's role in ordering the military to commit a war crime. But this isn't the whole issue, or maybe even the most important one.
Over the last few days and weeks, we have heard a lot about the professionalism of our military, how they are thoroughly trained in what constitutes an illegal order, and that they are a bastion against an authoritarian government. Well, I've always thought the military was pretty Trumpy. Military veterans voted for Trump by large margins. And when they were faced with an obviously illegal order to blatantly commit a war crime, it took about 2 seconds for them to say, "Yes SIR! We will KILL those people! Yes SIR!" After everyone, up and down the chain of command, had been trained not to.
So much for the professionalism and moral fiber of our military.
That's what happens when Fox Noise, Newsmax, and OAN are blaring on the TV's in the PX, base barbershops, barracks dayrooms, etc.
We've known since 1945 that propaganda kills people on the scale of millions. We bear responsibility for brainwashing our military.
All those military bases need to get with the program:
FOXTHEN
MSNOW
Watch “The Brainwashing of my Dad” on YouTube. Her father recovered after tuning out of Fox.
Starting with General Caine and Admiral Bradley in this case.
I do imagine it’s pretty tough to question the SECDEF (Sukwar) in the heat of the moment - not defending such decision (s), but acknowledging whether people with 20-30-more years of their lives invested in a military career would pick a fight w/him in the moment- the ‘fog of war’, as our esteemed Sukwar stated at the podium…
There is no heat of the moment here. The "fog of war" is a BS argument. The officers weren't getting shot at. They were sitting comfortably in their offices staring at computer screens. Nobody was getting shot at, except for the people in the boat. They were sitting in the middle of the ocean. They couldn't run anywhere. Nobody was coming to their defense. We had hours (at least) to decide what to do, and nobody in our military was in any physical danger at any time.
You are correct that resisting an illegal order could ruin a career. That is the point. The military will cave to this kind of pressure, just like the law firms and university presidents. Probably even faster and with less pushback. Right now, that means that people in boats, who may or may not have done anything wrong, can be killed at Pete Hegseth's whim. This was a test, and the military failed. Suppose that Trump doesn't like the result of a future election, and he orders the military to occupy congress and arrest the Democrats. Now we see that they will just follow orders.
I agree with every word you have written. I was not supporting Sukwar’s argument. But if you are in that room, and your boss (the admiral) gives you an order, you already know that disobeying that order is a trip to prison. You may or may not believe you will eventually (read: in months or years) be vindicated and released. But you know in the moment, you’re going to the brig, and then to jail, likely somewhere like Leavenworth. It is the reality those underlings are well aware of. So unless one of those people has the spine to say, “No Sir” to a highly decorated Senior Officer, they’re going to follow orders, get through their tour of duty, and develop a serious substance abuse problem. It could be years before any of them is willing to give up the goods on their boss.
It is definitely a conundrum for military personnel. The article by General Hertling (https://www.thebulwark.com/p/what-americans-should-understand-about-the-military-disobeying-illegal-orders-two-oaths) really helped me to understand the illegal order situation in a broad sense and how it should work in terms of not obeying illegal orders. This is such a mess.
Is it actually a conundrum? I think it's pretty clear what they are supposed to do. The problem is that we expect them to do things that are really hard. I read Hertling's article, and I was annoyed that we couldn't comment on it. He seems to think that military training is so rigorous and their sense of honor and duty is so strong that they will do the hard thing in the moment of truth. The evidence for that is pretty slim. People take oaths all the time and then don't live up to them. It's no different in the military. Their sense of loyalty to their comrades seems very similar to what you see in law enforcement. We see police cover up and lie for each other all the time. Why would we expect anything different in the military?
Our soldiers in Vietnam committed numerous atrocities. Horrific examples were revealed, sometimes, sort of, after a lot of digging. The deep disappointment is that 5 decades of an all-volunteer force were supposed to give us a military that was much more professional, with soldiers who really did rise above with their commitment, honor, and sense of duty. Now, when we really need them, in their first real test in Trump2, they failed.
Why do they close comments on some articles?
I believe the old euphemism from several of my old units was, “in a world of shit”….whats the old bromide, “if you’ve been there, then you know”…
I eye rolled that "fog of war" comment. Fog of War applies BEFORE -- "how many guys are on the other side of that hill" -- or AFTER -- "how much damage did the air strike really do? -- but DURING? Not really. They saw the ship blow up. They watched. They saw survivors struggling in the water.
Hegseth talks about all the Washington Press Corps guys who "sit in air conditioned offices" passing judgement on the "war fighters." Okay, Pete. How many people involved in that strike WEREN'T sitting in an air conditioned office when it happened?
That's right: all of them. Sipping coffee. Watching monitors. Watching what was going on. All the options available to them. Senior, experienced people there with the luxury of deciding next moves. And they picked one.
This wasn't some E-2 who hadn't slept for two days slogging through the muck in some god-forsaken hellhole who has to decide if he's going to chuck the grenade into a building, not knowing if there are civilians inside or not. These are senior level officers, people with decades of experience, surrounded by their staffs, in AN AIR CONDITIONED ROOM, with all the time in the world. So something (pick one of many options) or do nothing. All on the table.
That's what makes this crime so truly awful.
I spent my entire career with the US Army in one form or another - active duty, contractor and government civilian. Most of my service was during the Cold War but I also did a 6-month deployment to Afghanistan as an Army civilian. The vast majority of men and women I served with were dedicated and decent individuals. I never met a single stereotype that you see so often in the movies. People are complex - I would bet my last dollar that those 82nd Airborne Soldiers who cheered Trump at Fort Bragg would be the first ones to rescue someone from an accident or who was being threatened by thugs. I am angered and dismayed at the compliance of the senior military to Trump policies, but you have to understand that subservience to civilian and military authority is deeply embedded in military culture. You do not make to a senior position in the military by being a rebel. We human beings are also great at rationalizing our behavior - no doubt that many senior leaders believe that by going along with "small" things, they can stop the worst things from happening. That does not excuse or justify the actions that our military is taking off the coast off the coast of Venezuela. There needs to be an investigation and accountability for the actions by those involved. Meanwhile, we all need to speak out against the unlawful use of the military, to include the occupation of our cities.
Sorry, those 82nd Airborne troops were wrong in cheering him like they did. Disgusting display. It was a purely political event. The Senior NCO's should have stood in the door over it. They didn't. The esteem I used to hold for that unit took a fatal round that day. If they were forced to attend they could have remained silent. I have respect for those troops who were forced to march in trump's birthday parade. They shuffled along in non-military imprecision as a silent protest against being used for personal and political purposes. They made the parade look as stupid as they (correctly) thought it was.
I think (always dangerous) that I read a piece that the soldiers appearing right behind the dear leader, cheering him on, were chosen for that propaganda picture and non-dear leader supporters were culled out of the joyous gathering….do I have that right? If so, I wonder what glorious duties the non supporters were awarded. Latrine scrubbing, anyone?
Yes, those 82nd Airborne troops were absolutely wrong to cheer Trump's political comments. And I blame their leaders even more - for not making it clear to them in advance what their proper conduct should have been. And if those leaders did not counsel those Soldiers afterwards, then shame on them for again failing their responsibilities of leadership. However, the point I was making is that people are complex and you cannot define them by a single instance of behavior or even their political views. For example, as a government civilian, I worked with a retired Army Sergeant Major who had very different political views from me, but he was one of the best people I ever worked with; I could always count on him (in my experience, people that you can count on are worth their weight in gold). All the Republican poll workers that I served with during the last election in my county were every bit as dedicated and helpful as the Democratic poll workers were. And like I said, if I were in an accident, or threatened in a dark alley, I would have no doubt that if there were Soldiers from the 82nd Airborne nearby, they would do something to help me.
Sorry to “double dip”, but since reading your comment I couldn’t stop thinking about it. I share some similar experience. I joined the USMC in 1975 - shortly prior to formal cessation of hostilities with N Vietnam. In early ‘76 I found myself assigned to USMC 3rd Marine Air Wing HQ on the island of Okinawa, Japan in a group w/4 senior officers, about a dozen Senior NCO’s, and one other junior enlisted PFC & me. Needless to say all but me and the other PFC had served at least a couple of tours in Vietnam. Several had also served combat tours in Korea in the 50’s. As you noted, these men were also complicated individuals, but the finest mentors a kid like me could have had. Did I agree with what they had to offer on numerous and various subjects? Hell No! But were they men of dignity and honor? Absolutely. These were hard human beings - but I learned an awful lot about life from them. Fifty years later I still have a picture in my mind of every one of them. And I am grateful for every difficult lesson I learned from them. Thanks Kurt, for reminding me of all of those with whom I served.
Thank you Timothy, for your comments and what you shared about your time in the Marines (The Bulwark Community is the best). My father was in the 1st Marine Division during the Korean War (an Army historian wrote that the 1stMarDiv in the Chosin Reservoir Campaign was one of the greatest military units in American history - you can imagine how proud that makes me). Folks who serve in the military are regular human beings, with the same flaws as everyone else. I think what sets active duty/vets apart is that no matter why they went into the military, they learn to serve and care about something more important than themselves (even if it is just their fellow squad members). Most vets I have been around have a strong belief in the value of service. It disturbs me when I see military folks supporting Trump, but I try hard not to judge them - I have done many stupid, immature and selfish things in my life and I hope that those things don't define the totality of who I am. And yes, I didn't appreciate how much I learned in the Army until I left it. Right now, I think it is critical that vets speak out and be as active as they can in opposing this administration. Thanks again for your comments!
Didn’t one guy quit a few weeks ago, probably over this? Admiral Holsey I think the name was.
Yes, you are right! Thanks for pointing that out.
Perfectly stated, Kurt. Thank you.
Unless he can’t read and never trained as a Navy officer, Admiral Bradley had to know he was being given an illegal order. Not even a fog machine blowing in his office or a Secretary of Defense blowing smoke could obscure what the admiral had to know. So, with that in mind, have a look at the jobs site of your choice and tell me how many listings you find for an experienced former admiral. None? Really? Hmmm. I wonder if Admiral Bradley knows that? You think? And do you think he knows what would happen to him if he failed to follow orders? Or if he spoke out about illegal orders? A court martial? Prison time? Does Admiral Bradley have a family, kids in school, a wife looking forward to his retirement? I don’t know anything about the man. But I feel deeply for him—and for every other uniformed officer in the U.S. military, serving at the pleasure of the sickest, cruelest, most demented and deranged man ever to be elected president of the United States.
Maybe he agreed with the order, and trusts like many others, that there will be no repercussions that Trump can’t bail him out of…..
"the land is much easier." Said the person who will never have HIS boots on the ground and who has never served one day in the military.
Right. Ask the people who served in Iraq and Afghanistan whether “the land is easier”. We are literally animals that live on land. Naval and air superiority are easy with our technology.
Considering about half of Venezuela is covered in forests and jungle, especially in their mountainous regions, ask someone who slogged up and down the Central Highlands of Vietnam how "Land is easier". Of course Donnie Draft Dodger wouldn't know.
You're forgetting that trump knows more about war than all the generals and admirals. In fact, no one in history has ever known more about war than trump. So if he says "the land is easier," it must be true!! After all, it had to be on land that he won his bone spurs.
Don't worry, the people of Venezuela will welcome us as liberators, and it'll all be over in a few weeks, something something shock 'n awe.
Worth noting: no Trump family member has ever served. Ever. Let that sink in.
I've given up hope that Trump will face any justice. He's already too old and addled and in a year or two he may be alive but beyond reach. These other people though . . . they must face real consequences for their crimes
When/if Dems take the House, leave Trump in office, but impeach the cabinet one by one for two years, starting with Hegseth.
This. So much this. I could care less aboit getting Trump impeached (again), and the SC ensured he'll face no legal ramifications for his actions. The underlings though? At the very least impeach them.
It was so sad watching Little Marco doing all that enthusiastic asskissing while Trump just slept through it. I suppose he probably caught it on Jimmy Kimmel, tho.
The clips I saw had Trump stirring a bit when Hegseth did the obligatory attack on the press.
Dream a little dream of fascism.
Near as I could translate, Trump said "Gotta do it" before returning to his slumber.
He kind a came back to life then didn't he?
Colbert sure caught Trumpster napping. But then who didn't? Those who watch FOX
"But of course Hegseth would presumably still have been reachable after he left the room, by secure phone—or on Signal!—to discuss that second decision."
Good one, Bill! I'd nearly forgotten about Signal Gate. The amount of insanity is overwhelming.
Maybe his wife or brother were watching since they seem to have free access to classified information. Petey could ask them.
I think he needs help from the two relatives to even read, or sign a document...
my bro-in-law has been disguising his illiteracy pretty successfully for 45 years.
I'm aware, do not tell a lot of persons, I explain to family members certain thing to
clear up confusion, even if heggy can read and write well, the alcohol has done some damage to his brain, maybe he admits that ?
Lot of distractions from Trumpster lately.
It’s hard to keep up. Flood the zone, indeed.
Before I read this, kudos to the individual who chose “praxis” as a word in the byline. Outstanding word choice.
I'll put my money on Egger.
Bet his SAT scores certify him as having all the best words.
If Egger gets the chance to interview Trump, they'll need to find him a translator.
Trump: What'd he say?
Translator: He asked why you make boat go bye-bye.
This made my day, too. I truly enjoy slowing down to reflect on the meaning of carefully chosen words!
Yes. Praxis can be tricky.
True. The use of praxis may not always be good praxis.
or practice
As Trump's cognitive decline continues, he will become more disinhibited, so there will be more racist tirades like the one yesterday.
Cheap Shots: Petey is both - incompetent and a liar. Just like everyone else who works in POS's administration.
Nice to see even the loons seem to care about starting Mr. no-wars president starting one with Venezuela or Mexico or whatever. Speaking of which, when are the Rs going to figure out that putting troops into Venezuela is just as bad as Hitler invading Poland, or Putin invading Ukraine?
Hitler and Putin both provided "justifications" for their actions. The prevention of drug smuggling will look no better to the rest of the world.
History is beyond their reach, as is Trump's.
“every single boat that we strike saves 25,000 American lives.”
She'll never get to be Attorney General by claiming lives saved in the thousands. She needs to watch more cabinet meetings to see how it's done.
Even when dear leader sleeps we need to maintain the obsequiousness as you never know who may tattle when he wakes, or if he will want to view the footage to reassure himself his pets were appropriately deferential. The depths we’ve sunk to, where Democrats last year threw sleepy Joe Biden overboard and now we have sleeping Donald Trump, and the GOP chorus responds by continuing the soundtrack.
Sleepy Joe and . . . . Drooling Don?
Dozy Don.
Dozy Don for the win.
Dozy Don. 2 syllable, and alliterative. (Trump himself seems to like my “Trumplicans” appellation.)
I’ll remember that one.
During the New York trial, geniuses came up with Don Snoreleone, aka the Nodfather.
Or maybe the Teflon Don, since so little seems to stick to him, though the smell is becoming a bit more noticeable of late.
I've always said the only real difference between Trump and Gotti is that Gotti had a better tailor.
Gotti died in federal prison - we can wish.
. . . . . . any justice in this world . . . . .
When the days of Trump honoring himself in this world are over, perhaps we can hope there will be a Gladiator in his future...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I25Wp6ZLk7Y
Every single boat we strike prevents another hurricane through the magic of Trump.
We used to have Rev. Pat Robertson tell us that we had hurricanes because of gay rights. Now God apparently is MAGA.
It's 300 million people, or don't bother. Trump doesn't deal in thousands.
Right now she's running for NY governor. She may be done with federal level politics for now but she is worried that her records as a House member might be subject to subpoena. What was she doing on Jan 6 and thereafter?
😂😂😂
Ask her why Mr War on Drugs is pardoning drug traffickers?
If Ilhan Omar is—in Trump’s words—garbage (which anyone with his eyes open can see she is clearly not), what is Trump? Garbage+? An offshoot of the USA Network to which we have all been forcibly subscribed? Twenty-four-7 programming starring a grotesque foul-mouthed lump of a man on a mission to turn the United States of America into a shithole country? Trump says the U.S. is at a tipping point. I disagree. I think we are at a turning point. I think one American household after another is turning off the Trump channel, turning away from the endless scandals and coverups and lies and chaos and corruption of the Trump administration, turning away from garbage+.
Watching this “briefing” felt like witnessing a nation extinguish itself one filament at a time. Not the mercy of a sudden blackout. A slow, surgical dimming. A deliberate throttling of civic oxygen. Question by non-question. The light receded with every obsequious nod, every pre-chewed provocation masquerading as inquiry, every hollow-boned influencer mistaking proximity to power for the burden of truth, and in that feverish half-glow, you could feel the tectonic shift.
The Pentagon wasn’t addressing a republic, or a public, or anything resembling a nation of thinking beings. It was whispering to its own reflection. The briefing room had become a gilded hall of mirrors, no scrutiny, just self-admiration arranged in a circle.
That mirror doesn’t simply reflect a captured institution or a vandalized chain of command. It reflects us. The whole malignant tableau, the sycophants with PRESS badges dangling like stolen credentials, the spokesperson reciting state-sanctioned delusion as though language itself had conceded defeat, the engineered silence where accountability once lived, none of it exists in a vacuum. It exists because the country built the vacuum willingly.
This government isn’t an aberration. It’s an x-ray.
Every word uttered from that podium, every lie allowed to stand unmolested, every war crime wrapped in patriotic cellophane, each is a diagnostic image of the national psyche. Not the aspirational America etched into marble and myth, but the America that tolerated this, normalized this, voted for this. The America that long ago traded civic rigor for emotional anesthesia. The America that insists it is better than this even as it sinks, knee-deep and unblinking, into its own moral sediment.
In the end, the Pentagon didn’t speak to the nation. It spoke to the mirror, and the mirror, with pitiless clarity, spoke back.
Kind of like getting a look-in to a1969 Politbureau meeting
Ironically, Trump understands that a brand, like the USA or Trump rely on good will as an essential element of their brands value.
Yet, he appears to be doing everything in his power to destroy all of the good will this nation has earned over the years.; through USAID and immigration.
Couple this with his illegal and unconstitutional extrajudicial murders, and by the time he leaves office, the world will believe we’re worse than Putin and Russia.
A high bar, but Trump's working it. I wonder if the world doesn't already think we're worse. Putin does offer a certain consistency that we can't match right now.
Agreed…:)
Might this not be the objective, though? Disassociate the U.S. from the "weakling" and "woke" countries that do the democracy and human rights stuff and emerge with a new identity as global mob boss?
Good point, very well could be…:)
Steve, is there any doubt that this regime is determined to be seen as the scary and unpredictable mob boss to the world?
The deliberate destruction of soft power and longstanding alliances of mutual respect and trust will take generations to rebuild, if it's even possible.
That day may already be here - especially through the eyes of our (former) allies…
They've already cut back on intelligence sharing with us. It will only be a matter of time (if they're not doing it already) when our former allies are feeding us misinformation to find out which enemies we're in bed with.
It’s going to take years to realign their defense without our support, but in the meantime, they know we are not trustworthy and will behave differently towards us in many ways. I fear greatly for our children and wonder what might happen in the event of some questionable military adventure by this administration - will our ‘allies’ support us? Will our ‘enemies’ undermine us? Just who are our ‘allies’ today? The Saudi’s? The Qutaris? The Russians? As the old farmers in my native rural NH would often say, ‘hard tellin’, not knowin’….
They've already cut back on intelligence sharing with us.”
Agreed, and that’s just the start. Canada just bought a 72 Saab JAS 39 Griper’s, replacing the F-35 from Lockheed Martin.
And most of Europe is following suit. They aren’t buying US anymore; they’re rebuilding their own Military Industrial Complex (MIC), since America can’t be trusted, especially when it comes to Trump and defending Article 5 of NATO.
Only now is the MIC finally waking the F**k Up and realizing their future NATO orders aren’t going to materialize. It’s about time these useless invertebrates grew a spine, although it may be too late.
That said, European Airlines are also starting to buy more Airbus’s, instead of Boeing, Lockheed Martin and other big manufacturers of Commercial Aircraft….:)
Definitely!…:)
So the orange narcissist-felon and his carefully coifed secretary of defense have thrown the admiral under the bus. But it is possible--long shot--that the admiral will restate and provide in evidence (tomorrow) the order he was given, in the presence of witnesses, to 'kill them all.'
Meantime, the actual perpetrators, the chain of command below him, may recall Mark Kelly's clear words of warning. They are now in the direct line of legal fire, along with their admiral.
The word 'accountability,' evaded so long and so successfully by the orange narcissist-felon and his creepy cult-regime sycophants, may eventually happen.
"'Tis a consummation devoutly to be wished" (Hamlet).
The problem is that the Admiral should not have obeyed or passed down the order. Period. End of story.
The fact that he did so, despite whatever paper trail he provides implicating Hesgeth, is immaterial. We hanged people after WW2 for just following the wrong types of orders
Part of the Admiral's job/duty/responsibilities is to NOT obey or pass down such orders.
Of course. But he did not raise the question. And he implicated all his engaged subordinates. It's a tragedy, unfolding like a slo-mo car crash.
That is the other thing, all of the officers below him are also culpable. Each had the duty to refuse the order as it came down--so by passing the order down he screwed over all those below him.
The only people who really have an out in that kind of situation are enlisted personnel--and even they would face jeopardy.
Too true. It must, MUST come out. All of it.
agree but we will never know the full circumstances. The Admiral may have been given classified information that made him believe it was necessary to kill everyone. Hell maybe those fishermen were Al Qaida including the real Osama. We will never know!
:eyeroll:
Sounds like something they might say.
RE: "Part of the Admiral's job/duty/responsibilities is to NOT obey or pass down such orders."
EXACTLY!!!
Guess he didn't see that video made by those half-dozen traitorous seditionists.
Oh, wait. Or this one either...
https://www.newsweek.com/video-pete-hegseth-telling-military-not-follow-illegal-orders-resurfaces-11146747
I've never served, but I'd imagine that to make admiral one has to be really good at CYA and palace intrigue. I have to guess that the Admiral has a very long and complete paper trail.
Definitely, Mike. But there will be a basic price to pay.
j2
I don't doubt that, and I want the book thrown at the Admiral and whoever "pulled out trigger."
I raised the point with the idea that SecWar won't have as easy a time with the underbusing as he thinks.
Mike, I prefer secdef, in the lowest possible 'case.' I won't pander to the childish attempt at renaming. j2
My intention is to use that ridiculous insulting title as a pejorative term. It probably doesn't come across that way, but that's what's going on when I type. 😀
Put it in single quotes, Mike. 'Supposed.'
j2
Here’s the issue: I have no idea what’s in a man’s heart. either the admiral is going to back Sukwar Hegseth & Trump to the hilt- knowing Trump will take care of him and scaring the shit out of every single uniformed human being beneath him to STFU and follow his lead - or he’s going to turn on Sukwar and Trump and lay down on a grenade. I know a little about this guy. But I don’t know what’s in his heart. He might not know the answer himself.
I don't think people appreciate how much Republicans *hate* the United States as it exists today. They despise the idea of a culturally diverse, socially tolerant nation.
The Republicans do seem determined to make this very clear to us.
When Trump's apologists say "He really loves America," what they mean is: "He loves what America used to be --around 1900, or maybe 1820."
No, they mean he loves what they imagine America used to be, but they are, as always, delusional.