68 Comments
User's avatar
⭠ Return to thread
Deutschmeister's avatar

"Does Donald Trump want to go to jail? Does he want to be found in contempt of court? Does he yearn for martyrdom — a spectacular scene of the ex-president in handcuffs? Otherwise, why has he spent the last few days baiting, insulting, and threatening the judge, the jury pool, and potential witnesses?"

Because he is scared. He is very, very scared. And for once he has good reason to feel the way that he does. For the first time in his life he is faced with the real possibility that there will be consequences for his actions that fit the scope of his behavior, that he finally will be held fully accountable for what he has done while thinking that he can get away with anything. He increasingly resembles a feral animal that feels cornered and looks for any pathway out of danger. Accordingly you can expect for him to become even more agitated and out of control as the process goes forward and he slowly, gradually, but inevitably realizes that his fate no longer is in his own hands. Jack Smith and the legal system need only stay on message and stick to their script. The vice grip will squeeze accordingly as justice is served. And if we are lucky, at the end of the sordid spectacle we finally will receive confirmation after all that our legal system works and that no person is above the law, no matter how many others may try to indicate or act otherwise.

Tick, tock. Tick, tock. Tick, tock. The countdown is on. Reality is looming ever larger on the horizon as the truth sets in. Enjoy your morning coffee and the sweet taste of freedom that accompanies it while one small, disturbed, deranged little man increasingly realizes that it is not something to be taken for granted.

Expand full comment
Dan-o's avatar

100% agree with you. I also think it is very possible that he wants to be corrected by the judge and even possibly held briefly. It aligns quite nicely with his whole narrative of persecution. And to say nothing of swelling the anger in his deceived followers. Saw this weekend 93% of FOX viewers believe he has done nothing wrong.

FOX hosts could also be in the same cell with the IGF.

Expand full comment
BriDub's avatar

It's like "The Tell Tale Heart"!

Expand full comment
Mingo's avatar

The answer to the three questions in the first paragraph is yes, yes and yes. In my fantasy world TFG doesn't make the debate stage because he's cooling his heels in the pokey for contempt of court. Yes, he's scared and he should be. This is serious shit. He's responsible for the mess he's made. Cocaine Mitch is responsible for mess of not convicting him when he had the chance. The problem with people like TFG is that nobody ever told him "no".

Expand full comment
Kongming's avatar

Inshallah

Expand full comment
Bruce Brittain's avatar

"Reality is looming ever larger..." Perhaps, Deutschmeister, but "reality" for millions of Trumpsters is what they are fed by the dis-information industry and the talk from that cesspit is getting more dangerous, as pointed out earlier in Morning Shots. Talk of assassinations of public figures (Pence) and violent threats against those who would oppose Trump are the precursors of actual violence and bloodshed. Yes, I hope I'm wrong but fear I'm not.

Expand full comment
Susan Troy's avatar

Listening to the threats of violence coming from Trump, De Santis, and others, I have pretty munch concluded that the Republican Party is now Fascist.

Expand full comment
dcicero's avatar

When Mark Levin finishes up one of his (predictable) rants, the proper response ought to be, "lighten up, Francis."

Where is our SGT Hulka? Is anyone on Fox News capable?

Expand full comment
heybige's avatar

Here is the sad truth about the Republican party these days - I would argue the political figure most likely to be assassinated is Mike Pence (!) for being a 'traitor'. Not Joe Biden who they say they hate, not Hunter Biden who they can't stop talking about, not Nancy Pelosi or Shift Schiff - any of their political opponents. It's one of their own.. You can see the anger and the delusion when he's confronted. The GOP cult, in a nutshell.

Expand full comment
Deutschmeister's avatar

You may be right. But those thugs and wannabe soldiers would have to go up against real military personnel, better armed and with actual training and expertise in handling violence and upheaval. For all their bluster, those "patriots" don't want to go to jail any more than Trump does, much less die for his personal cause. I can see where they'd turn tail and run once any real resistance to their tactics were in the offing. That said, random acts of violence and terrorism are not out of the question as they seek to do something and send a message with a minimum of personal risk.

Expand full comment
Donald Cea's avatar

Typical for bullies. Cowards at heart.

Expand full comment
JF's avatar

I actually think a fair number of MAGAs would be willing to die for Trump. They did it with Covid; denying its existence with their final breath.

Expand full comment
knowltok's avatar

Ipso facto, they can't do it again.

Expand full comment
suzc's avatar

LOLOL

Expand full comment
JF's avatar

Haha! Not those particular Republicans!

Once vaccines became available, Republican counties had much higher Covid death rates than Democratic counties. Electorally, that’s progress!

Expand full comment
knowltok's avatar

It is also Darwinial progress.

Spell check doesn't like that word, but I proclaim it to be one, now and henceforth evermore.

Expand full comment
Mark S's avatar

Works for me. Right or wrong.

Expand full comment
Bridget Collins's avatar

My guess is that the Capitol police and the DC cops might like re-do. -- Especially without their hands tied behind their backs.

Expand full comment
Linda Oliver's avatar

That’s why it was so essential to see all those hundreds (and counting) of “patriots” get jail time for that little Jan. 6 frolic.

Expand full comment
Bruce Brittain's avatar

It's the random acts of personal violence and terrorism that concern me most. I've always thought the idea of Trumpsters with AR 15s taking on the government was preposterous. Back in the day (18th century) when the government and the state or private militias (see Whiskey Rebellion) were armed with the same basic weapons, the threat was serious. AR 15s against Cobra gunships, et al, in today's environment is not serious, just bluster.

Expand full comment
User's avatar
Comment removed
Aug 7, 2023
Comment removed
Expand full comment
Ben Gruder's avatar

Yes. I"m tired of the adults coddling that special delicate snowflake. If law enforcement is dissuaded by bluster and threats, it's not really law enforcement anymore, is it?

Expand full comment
Karen Livolsi's avatar

See, I like your approach. Won’t shut up yet? Spend three days in klink with no electronic communication devices. You still have your secret service detail. They may run to McDonald’s for a “Bag O Macs” and ketchup to go with a bushel of fries and a gallon of Diet Coke. Don’t even think about throwing food.

He still won’t shut up? Throw him back in for a reminder tour. Nothing long, serious or dangerous say like prison. But, the orange cry baby should be impressed.

As none of this will culminate the delays he so desperately wants and up till now, proudly misused in other court proceedings.

Expand full comment
MoosesMom's avatar

I think you're right overall, but I can see where trump thinks (and has been told) that going to "jail" in a federal prison set up for security for 2-3 days (which would be the likely first censure imposed), wouldn't be "hard". He can make millions upon millions in fund-raising and merchandise. Would he be so cavalier if he had to stay there until trial date? Nope. But what's 2 nights?

Expand full comment
knowltok's avatar

If that happens, someone has got to shove a microphone in Susan Collins's face and ask if she thinks he's learned his lesson now. She being such an expert and all.

Expand full comment
TW Falcon's avatar

As I said at the time, he learned his lesson alright. He learned they (the Republicans) would let him get away with anything.

Expand full comment
Robert Jaffee's avatar

I doubt it. She also voted to confirm Kavanaugh, because he assured her he wouldn’t vote to repeal Roe and would follow precedent.

That didn’t exactly work out well for all the women and girls in this country...:)

Expand full comment
knowltok's avatar

Just a bit of sarcasm there on her being an expert.

Expand full comment
Deutschmeister's avatar

I had a couple of rough nights at a hotel not so long ago. I just never thought to raise money for myself off of the hardship and position myself as being a victim of a conspiracy to rob me of my sleep and a decent TV signal. Perhaps Trump is smarter than I am (shudder) and certainly more experienced at finding ways to cash in on any perceived sleight or misadventure. Next time I will be better prepared.

Expand full comment
Mark S's avatar

Nice comment. Perhaps he borrowed a set of balls and realized that PT Barnum was not wrong.

Expand full comment
Robert Jaffee's avatar

I agree with your assessment, but Trump knows he won’t go to jail. Any attempt to hold him in contempt with be met on deaf ears; and will only galvanize the base even further.

Spiro Agnew was as crooked as they come. He took bribes as mayor of Baltimore, Governor of Maryland and as VP; he ultimately worked out a deal to avoid jail time. When Trump is convicted, which he will be, he’ll work out an agreement while the case is on appeal and walk away scot-free.

The tin-foil hat party is right about one thing; we have two-tiered justice system; just not accurately portrayed by these right-wing snake-oil salesmen.

Trump would be in jail now if not for his status as a former president. Or at least be forced to wear an ankle monitor. After all, he has a private jet that could take him to many places without extradition; Saudi Arabia comes to mind! And if anyone threatened witnesses and tried to block the outcome of a democrat election, they’d be in jail without bail. We have people who have received sentences of eight years or more for voting illegally; he tried to defraud the US government and committed his crimes in plain sight and on tape.

Bottom line: whatever consequences he ultimately faces, it will be minuscule compared to what he deserves. And god help us should he be re-elected; all hell will break lose, and democracy will finally be dead! And we’ll have no one to blame but ourselves.

Expand full comment
suzc's avatar

I would be SO relieved if he jumped on his plane and flew to anywhere without extradition and was never allowed back on US soil!!!! I'd be fine with that at this point.

The previously-sane part of the country just needs to be able to breathe clean air again for a minute.

Expand full comment
Mark S's avatar

I would be irritated if Desuckass took over the hefty orange guy's properties (Eminent domain, ya know). But it wouldn't surprise me. And it just might be worth the price.

Expand full comment
Paul K. Ogden's avatar

Oh, if Trump is convicted of just a few of those felonies, he is absolutely going to prison. No doubt about it.

Expand full comment
Robert Jaffee's avatar

I hope your right, but I wouldn’t get my hopes up. Any conviction will leave him out of jail on appeal. If he is elected again, his DOJ will refuse to defend the guilty cases and they will dismissed without prejudice by the circuit court. It happened during the Trump administration, when Trump ordered Barr not to defend several cases in which Trump sycophants pled or were found guilty. The cases were dropped.

And if he loses, and eventually loses his appeals, then you have the issue of the Secret Service; do they protect him behind bars? How would that even work? Perhaps he’d be confined to an army base?

I don’t know, but it wouldn’t be in the nations interests to put him behind bars; especially when he has tens of millions of devoted followers who might cause another violent insurrection or worse.

It’s not fair, but in reality, nothing is fair in politics; neither justice itself, or our system of justice.

Expand full comment
Mark S's avatar

Politics and the law are two totally different things. The hefty gent tries to combine them. He is iffy on one and 100% wrong on the other. Not a good sign. But that is partially why there will be trials in 4 different places.

BTW--Has the fat guy mentioned the favorable judge draw in Florida? The way he has whined and bitched about a trial in/around D.C.? Just wondering.

Expand full comment
knowltok's avatar

Hard disagree. If convicted, I don't see how he avoids jail, and I do see it in the nation's interest. These are very serious crimes, and your point about him having followers who might cause another insurrection is exactly why he needs to serve jail time if convicted.

I don't know the rules about being released on appeal, but I presume they have something to do with a person's danger to society. We don't let murderers out on appeal, why should we let coup plotters out on appeal?

Expand full comment
Youngy's avatar

FFS, Steve Bannon is out of jail on appeal right now for much less serious crimes.

Expand full comment
suzc's avatar

They also have to do with a flight risk.

Expand full comment
knowltok's avatar

I can see that going either way. One the one hand he has a plane. On the other, he has secret service agents that aren't going to let themselves get kidnapped to Cuba. The probably wouldn't even grow beards and move to Montana to live off the grid in a small cabin beside a nice trout stream either.

Expand full comment
suzc's avatar

He can actually choose to not have that protection. They don't have to go with him.

Expand full comment
Robert Jaffee's avatar

I agree wholeheartedly, but the issue is complex. One can make the same argument about Nixon’s pardon. He deserved jail, but doing so could have torn this nation apart. Many of the dynamics are the same. Illegal activity, dirty tricks, cover up’s and lies.

I guess we can thank Trump for one thing; he’s keeping our critical reasoning skills working overtime...:)

Expand full comment
TW Falcon's avatar

Nixon should have gone to jail. It would have made it clear that a president is not above the law. Instead, we now have to deal with this shit.

Expand full comment
TW Falcon's avatar

Nixon should have gone to jail. It would have made it clear that a president is not above the law. Instead, we now have to deal with this shit.

Expand full comment
Deutschmeister's avatar

Except the magnitude of Trump's behavior and collective corruption far exceeds that of Nixon's in their worst excesses, most specifically the willingness to resort to a literal uprising and attempted coup to overthrow an elected government and the establishment/endorsement of a quasi-militia to that end -- as opposed to Nixon's "great silent majority." I could understand and support Ford's decision and rationale for it, but the Trump case is so much more serious in its extremes and in the character of the person overall. Any pardon of Trump automatically would be, in my opinion, the grossest misuse of presidential power in American history, with the Nixon case a distant second at best.

Expand full comment
Robert Jaffee's avatar

Very true, but the tapes proved he tried to weaponize the DOJ and FBI (separate at the time), and the CIA as part of the coverup. He had an enemies list. Used the IRS to audit enemies and even considered using the military to thwart any opposition and opponents, in case riots broke out in the streets.

One has to wonder, if Nixon had an entire “right-wing” media ecosystem carrying water for him at the time, and a plurality of Congressmen and Senators calling the impeachment process a hoax and a lie, whether Nixon would have resigned or fought; using all of the tools of government at his disposal?

Just a thought...:)

Expand full comment
Anna Kingry's avatar

Nixon tried to cheat and lie to help himself win. No comparison to Trump who has no judgment, no knowledge of governance, no respect for anybody or anything.

Expand full comment
Robert Jaffee's avatar

I didn’t comment on Trump’s competency; just the parallels between the various crimes each committed. That said, point duly noted...:)

Expand full comment
Jeff's avatar

What will be interesting to see is how his followers react. It seems that after seeing the J6 folks get jail, his in-person support has waned at his trial events.

Expand full comment
dcicero's avatar

It's been striking.

I think the difference might be in how "the defendant" has positioned these indictments vs how he positioned January 6. Before January 6, he was calling on patriots to defend the Constitution, to stop an assault on our democracy by Democrats. A lot of the J6 people said that's why they were there.

Now, "the defendant" is calling on his MAGA followers to defend HIM, not the Constitution, not American democracy. There are fewer people willing to go to prison for that. I think that's a hopeful thing.

Expand full comment
Mark S's avatar

Note that patriots are no longer what the hefty guy says anymore.

Expand full comment
Katie Harris's avatar

“Hope springs eternal”

Expand full comment
TW Falcon's avatar

"It's the hope that kills you."

-- Sarah Longwell

Expand full comment
Katie Harris's avatar

Fraud so! You, or Sarah, is correct.

Expand full comment
Deutschmeister's avatar

My hope is that as the weight of the evidence gradually mounts and the truth unfolds, as if waves rolling in with the tide that cannot be turned back, they eventually will accept reality and move on from him as the damaged, irreparable goods that he is. Unfortunately, that does not mean that they will change their mindset or their behavior, as long as there is a DeSantis or some other extremist who knows how to speak their language and is willing to tell them what they want to hear in the pursuit of personal gain and advancement.

Expand full comment
steve robertshaw's avatar

Another great comment.

Expand full comment
User's avatar
Comment removed
Aug 7, 2023
Comment removed
Expand full comment
suzc's avatar

He needs a muzzle! He needs to shut the hell up! He needs some consequences but the rest of us need a rest from his filthy mouth and his minions in Congress and the media.

Expand full comment
User's avatar
Comment removed
Aug 7, 2023
Comment removed
Expand full comment
suzc's avatar

Max, I think that's it. It's like being locked in a phone booth with a screaming 2-yr-old for 48 hours without food or water!

Expand full comment
User's avatar
Comment deleted
Aug 7, 2023
Comment deleted
Expand full comment
Susan Troy's avatar

Nancy Pelosi? The courageous woman whose presence of mind pretty much stopped the insurrection? Give us all a break. Trump is a lying coward who sits on a golden toilet seat at Mar-a-Lago. Spare me.

Expand full comment
Walternate 🇺🇦🇨🇦🇪🇺🇹🇼🇩🇰🇬🇱🇲🇽🇵🇦's avatar

This man is supposed to be tough? Intimidating to our adversaries? She called him a scared puppy and he whines about how mean that was. Never mind that he's the source of some of the ugliest words ever uttered by a POTUS. What a weiner.

Expand full comment
Bridget Collins's avatar

Do you remember the photo where she faced off with him and his cabinet were all shrinking into the floor?

Donald Trump is scared shitless of Nancy Pelosi.

Expand full comment
Mike Lew's avatar

That's the part that boggles my mind the most. 45 is the biggest whiner I've ever seen. Yet, he's Rambo incarnate to his followers. I just don't get it.

Expand full comment
Karen Livolsi's avatar

At this point, the term delusional lunatics is a polite term to describe these supporters. Crazy is as crazy does.

Expand full comment
JF's avatar

It really is mass mental illness.

Expand full comment
Nancy (South NJ coast)'s avatar

To my eyes the attacks on Pelosi read like a shout-out to his posse to "stand back and stand by." The two people who were most threatened by the violent mob at the Capitol on Jan. 6 were Mike Pence and Nancy Pelosi. trump has to be careful now about what he says regarding Pence. But he knows Pelosi gets his peeps' blood up, and she isn't on the witness list.

Expand full comment