Just how is it working? More attention? More noise? As Howard pointed out, results haven't resulted yet. I'm thinking back to last fall when just about every head in the punditry ( except Liberal Cynic ) warned of a colossal red wave and I personally got all funked up and then when the results resulted they weren't that result. I think w…
Just how is it working? More attention? More noise? As Howard pointed out, results haven't resulted yet. I'm thinking back to last fall when just about every head in the punditry ( except Liberal Cynic ) warned of a colossal red wave and I personally got all funked up and then when the results resulted they weren't that result. I think we're a bunch of backseat drivers, and the actual driver and his team have steered this country very well indeed and maybe they aren't stupid and are not operating with the goal of getting their noise and faces on screens.
Republicans are getting budgetary concessions outside of normal budget negotiations aren't they? The hostage takers are getting their demands--at a minimum--partially met. Dems should have held the line that budget discussions should only occur when they're passing a budget. Instead, we get budget negotiations 2 times a year now instead of just one--all because dems caved to the economic terrorists when they pointed a loaded gun at the US economy. And this only ever happens when there's a dem in the WH because dems love to cave to GOP hostage-taking and then never fight fire with fire by demanding taxes on the rich when they have the majority under a GOP president. So not only do dems allow the precedent to set in, they also never take advantage of it to get their own demands met even after they allow the precedent to be set. That's called getting suckered and being weak.
Sorry but have you thought this through? This is a game of chicken. Biden is best saying little and getting McCarthy to blink. Sadly the GOP wants nothing. They are like a whiney bteenager who would cut off her nose to spite her face.
It is not that Dems love to cave but the weaker party is the one who wants something - like to pass good legislation.
Dems are caving by entertaining hostage-taking with the party taking the economy hostage. They'll keep doing this every time they have a house majority under a dem WH until dems put their foot down and make the GOP own the default they're threatening. In addition, the public will get more and more numbed to this shit and it'll become normalized for the GOP to take the debt ceiling hostage every time there is a dem president. Remember all the shit we've been talking about since Trump came along about an assault on norms? This falls squarely into that window. The time to negotiate a budget is *during budget negotiations,* not during national debt payments. Keep letting the GOP run over norms and usurp the dems in public while the dems bend over willingly for them. I'm sure it'll keep going so well for the dems that way.
Sorry but I don't see that Dems really can do much. Again, it is like dealing with a teenager. The GOP was not like this in the 80s under Reagan. I may be wrong but the party who wants nothing holds the cards.
Maybe the GOP got this way because the dems let them all along? This started when dems caved to the Tea Party and started negotiating with them when they pointed the default pistol at the national economy in 2011. Had they put their foot down and let the Tea Party push us into default back then the GOP would have taken the kind of political losses to discourage them from doing this shit again now. Instead, they negotiated with terrorists and set the precedent that it's okay to put a default pistol to the head of the national economy to get budget demands. The dems set the precedent back then and the GOP is simply picking the pistol back up again because they know that using it works against weak sauce dems.
I'm not grateful. I'm mad as hell. Dems keep encouraging the "REPUGNANTS" to be more repugnant in the future by agreeing to negotiate. If you negotiate with terrorists, it only encourages more terrorism in the future because they will point at the last time they got things they wanted by committing economic terrorism. Do you get what "setting a precedent" means?
One party is lobbing hand grenades while the other party cowers in fear at the thought of hand grenades going off. Know what that encourages? More hand grenade throwing in the future. If a grenade goes off now and the GOP owns it, know what that does? It discourages future hand grenade throwing once the damage of a grenade going off is seen by all. Then all of a sudden it's not so cool to hold debt ceilings hostage anymore because there's an economic body count in the historical record associated with doing that sort of thing.
I get what you’re saying Travis but in the game of chicken involving 2 drivers heading towards each other, and neither car avoids the head on collision at 100mph, you’re likely to have everybody in both cars dead. Sure, I agree this should not be happening, but the chicken game needs to be be banned (ie. made impossible to play) at a time when we don’t have the two cars barrelling towards each other. And yeh I know that’ll be hard to do (filibuster etc.) but maybe the 14th amendment solution could be litigated after a deal to help avoid future chicken games. Or else we’ll have to wait to vote in enough reasonable congresspersons sometime in the future. But all parties being dead from the game is not a good result.
Getting bent over a barrel in public is NOT "governing." They're refusing to put their foot down against economic terrorists and they're getting owned in public as a result. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes. No wonder so much of the American voting public sees dems as being weak as shit when in power. They're getting bent over HARD in public right now and you call that "governing" lol.
I'm looking for the dems to stand up to the bomb-throwers and not let them get away with throwing bombs in exchange for hostage demands anymore. The time for deals is during budget negotiations, not when we're about to pay the nation's bills. My point is that caving to terrorists only encourages more future terrorism. Remember that whole "we don't negotiate with terrorists" thing that this county has always been about since the 1970's? It comes into play here for the very same reason. You don't allow precedents to be set that revolve around negotiation-by-threat-of-catastrophe. That's my point.
Please stop encouraging the dems to negotiate with terrorists just because you don't want your 401k gains from the last couple of years to get wiped dude. You're setting really bad precedents by being greedy as shit about your retirement gains. Maybe think about future generations and their having to deal with more economic hostage taking because people like you are too worried about whether or not you can cash out a 401k in the next 12-18 months.
Wow, you just blew right past all the future generations that will have to deal with this shit because people like you weren't strong enough to put their foot down in 2011 or 2023. Thanks for helping set shitty precedents that will continue ad infinitum because of present softness.
Just how is it working? More attention? More noise? As Howard pointed out, results haven't resulted yet. I'm thinking back to last fall when just about every head in the punditry ( except Liberal Cynic ) warned of a colossal red wave and I personally got all funked up and then when the results resulted they weren't that result. I think we're a bunch of backseat drivers, and the actual driver and his team have steered this country very well indeed and maybe they aren't stupid and are not operating with the goal of getting their noise and faces on screens.
Republicans are getting budgetary concessions outside of normal budget negotiations aren't they? The hostage takers are getting their demands--at a minimum--partially met. Dems should have held the line that budget discussions should only occur when they're passing a budget. Instead, we get budget negotiations 2 times a year now instead of just one--all because dems caved to the economic terrorists when they pointed a loaded gun at the US economy. And this only ever happens when there's a dem in the WH because dems love to cave to GOP hostage-taking and then never fight fire with fire by demanding taxes on the rich when they have the majority under a GOP president. So not only do dems allow the precedent to set in, they also never take advantage of it to get their own demands met even after they allow the precedent to be set. That's called getting suckered and being weak.
Sorry but have you thought this through? This is a game of chicken. Biden is best saying little and getting McCarthy to blink. Sadly the GOP wants nothing. They are like a whiney bteenager who would cut off her nose to spite her face.
It is not that Dems love to cave but the weaker party is the one who wants something - like to pass good legislation.
Dems are caving by entertaining hostage-taking with the party taking the economy hostage. They'll keep doing this every time they have a house majority under a dem WH until dems put their foot down and make the GOP own the default they're threatening. In addition, the public will get more and more numbed to this shit and it'll become normalized for the GOP to take the debt ceiling hostage every time there is a dem president. Remember all the shit we've been talking about since Trump came along about an assault on norms? This falls squarely into that window. The time to negotiate a budget is *during budget negotiations,* not during national debt payments. Keep letting the GOP run over norms and usurp the dems in public while the dems bend over willingly for them. I'm sure it'll keep going so well for the dems that way.
Sorry but I don't see that Dems really can do much. Again, it is like dealing with a teenager. The GOP was not like this in the 80s under Reagan. I may be wrong but the party who wants nothing holds the cards.
Maybe the GOP got this way because the dems let them all along? This started when dems caved to the Tea Party and started negotiating with them when they pointed the default pistol at the national economy in 2011. Had they put their foot down and let the Tea Party push us into default back then the GOP would have taken the kind of political losses to discourage them from doing this shit again now. Instead, they negotiated with terrorists and set the precedent that it's okay to put a default pistol to the head of the national economy to get budget demands. The dems set the precedent back then and the GOP is simply picking the pistol back up again because they know that using it works against weak sauce dems.
I'm not grateful. I'm mad as hell. Dems keep encouraging the "REPUGNANTS" to be more repugnant in the future by agreeing to negotiate. If you negotiate with terrorists, it only encourages more terrorism in the future because they will point at the last time they got things they wanted by committing economic terrorism. Do you get what "setting a precedent" means?
So just roll over and take it is the preferred outcome? What does that solve long term?
One party is lobbing hand grenades while the other party cowers in fear at the thought of hand grenades going off. Know what that encourages? More hand grenade throwing in the future. If a grenade goes off now and the GOP owns it, know what that does? It discourages future hand grenade throwing once the damage of a grenade going off is seen by all. Then all of a sudden it's not so cool to hold debt ceilings hostage anymore because there's an economic body count in the historical record associated with doing that sort of thing.
I get what you’re saying Travis but in the game of chicken involving 2 drivers heading towards each other, and neither car avoids the head on collision at 100mph, you’re likely to have everybody in both cars dead. Sure, I agree this should not be happening, but the chicken game needs to be be banned (ie. made impossible to play) at a time when we don’t have the two cars barrelling towards each other. And yeh I know that’ll be hard to do (filibuster etc.) but maybe the 14th amendment solution could be litigated after a deal to help avoid future chicken games. Or else we’ll have to wait to vote in enough reasonable congresspersons sometime in the future. But all parties being dead from the game is not a good result.
Getting bent over a barrel in public is NOT "governing." They're refusing to put their foot down against economic terrorists and they're getting owned in public as a result. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes. No wonder so much of the American voting public sees dems as being weak as shit when in power. They're getting bent over HARD in public right now and you call that "governing" lol.
I'm looking for the dems to stand up to the bomb-throwers and not let them get away with throwing bombs in exchange for hostage demands anymore. The time for deals is during budget negotiations, not when we're about to pay the nation's bills. My point is that caving to terrorists only encourages more future terrorism. Remember that whole "we don't negotiate with terrorists" thing that this county has always been about since the 1970's? It comes into play here for the very same reason. You don't allow precedents to be set that revolve around negotiation-by-threat-of-catastrophe. That's my point.
Please stop encouraging the dems to negotiate with terrorists just because you don't want your 401k gains from the last couple of years to get wiped dude. You're setting really bad precedents by being greedy as shit about your retirement gains. Maybe think about future generations and their having to deal with more economic hostage taking because people like you are too worried about whether or not you can cash out a 401k in the next 12-18 months.
Wow, you just blew right past all the future generations that will have to deal with this shit because people like you weren't strong enough to put their foot down in 2011 or 2023. Thanks for helping set shitty precedents that will continue ad infinitum because of present softness.