Charlie, it's not that we want you to stop talking about Biden's age. It's that by spending all this time taking about it, and no mention at all about how Donald Trump is only two years younger, morbidly obese, spouting word salad with a family history of dementia, you are helping to further the narrative you're worried about. Joe Biden …
Charlie, it's not that we want you to stop talking about Biden's age. It's that by spending all this time taking about it, and no mention at all about how Donald Trump is only two years younger, morbidly obese, spouting word salad with a family history of dementia, you are helping to further the narrative you're worried about. Joe Biden does not look especially bad for someone of his age. Judged by that standard, he's pretty spry, especially in comparison to his opponent. The Trump campaign wants everyone to consider Biden's age in a vacuum, and you're doing exactly that.
Exactly. I don't think that anyone is saying that the media should never mention the fact that Biden is 80 years old. The problem is that the 'liberal' mainstream media obsessively repeats tired and lazy talking points about Biden's age, while ignoring the fact that Trump is only 4 years younger. And if they're not bringing up Biden's age they're ruminating over Hunter's issues or inflation.
As a result of this constant drumbeat, when many if not most people think of Biden they associate him with his octogenarian status, Hunter's travails, and high inflation. Like they associated Hilary Clinton with the emails and Benghazi. Never mind that Biden is definitely in better shape that Trump. Or that Hunter Biden doesn't hold elected office and even Jim Jordan's House committee hasn't been able to find anything that connects the elder Biden to his son's business dealings. And inflation was last year's news.
You know Mr. Sykes did something similar doing thr WI senatorial race...overly harping on Barnes shortcomings as a sign he (or dems) shouldn't have voted for him but Johnson's issues as just general problems any R faces. Like when Johnson put out those ads making Barnes darker...Mr. Sykes mentioned it as being bad but yet what the base wanted. He seems capable of calling out behavior but never to the point of withdrawing support.
In the end, Mr. Skyes maybe Never Trump, but he is still also apparently "Never Left". The idea that both sides deserve criticism is fair. Yet his criticism seems to be from the viewpoint of someone who wants so the left be more like the right used to be, not someone who wants to see the left succeed. He wants so badly for the Dems who will run people who will appeal to the old pre MAGA base...but as many have said, trying to co opt the Dem party is well...off-putting.
I am starting to want to read Bulwark just for JVL and the guest writers.....
I was really disappointed by Charlie's criticism of Barnes. It gave anti-Trump conservatives cover to vote for Johnson. And who was the greater threat to democracy? Barnes, or Johnson who tried to have fake Electoral College ballots turned in to be counted. (I know he tried to blame his staff for that, but if you believe anyone on his staff would have done that without his direction, or at least knowledge and approval, then I have got a bridge you might like.
This was discussed fully in the podcast yesterday. Biden simply looks and sounds older. It's all about perception. Murphy had some excellent advice on how to attempt to address this.
I'm a Democrat and know that Biden is absolutely up to the job as President. But this is about appearances, nothing rational. Even though Trump is close to Biden's age, Trump has a quickness and fire (with an extra topping of malice, anger and hatred) that Biden does not have. Biden seems low energy. He is not silver-tongued, never has been, but now with his decreased outward energy level, it makes things worse. Yeah, Trump has lost animation in his voice but he's still got a twinkle in his eye, a quick (if stupid) reaction to whatever comes at him. He can still bullshit fluently. Better than Biden. It's sad but true.
Trump is a complete loud mouth idiot when he talks. Biden is very quick on his feet. Do remember the SOTU where he was energized by the heckling of the bratty Republicans. He was able to get them to agree, on national TV, to not cut Social Security! When they realized what he had done, he laughed. He was amazing.
He knows how to wield power and talk to members of Congress. And yes, he did have a quick and strategically effect reaction at SOTU. He's also a hell of a negotiator, besting McCarthy in the debt ceiling talks. But our country's electoral judgment is increasingly less about content and more about affect and showmanship. And, I hate to say it, Biden *appears* kind of fragile or frail. Not in content but in visual and audio impression. Trump may be unhealthy, sloppy, and whiny, but nobody would call him frail (although he's emotionally and psychologically fragile as glass)
That's true, and its' all about perception. Trump is a showman, a master at manipulating the media, dominating the stage, and getting attention. He is also always on the attack and projects an animus, a primal rage, and an unencumbered sarcasm (complete with juvenile nicknames) that makes literally anyone else seem 'low energy' and weak by comparison.
I think you are conflating being loud and screaming malice with being fluent and articulate. I have never ever heard TFG actually deliver a thoughtful articulate statement. But I take your point.
Part of the reason people think that if Trump is because the media constantly edits his word salad into quotes without ever noting that they're doing it. It makes his statements look orders of magnitude more reasonable and coherent than they actually are.
This is very much like the liberal "Don't give Trump attention and he'll go away" belief.
By not talking about Biden's age, maybe you will feel comforted that it's not an issue, but a not insignificant portion of the voting public very much believes that it is an issue.
Many people voted for Biden over Trump to get Trump out of the White House, believing (falsely it seems) that both men would not be back in 2024 because of their age. Unfortunately both are back and age IS an issue, this time for Biden doubly so because he's the incumbent.
Again, it's not "don't talk about Biden's age." It's "Charlie is uncritically accepting the framing of the Trump campaign as the basis of his argument." By starting with "Biden is decrepit," you reinforce the idea that somehow Trump isn't in the exact same position, even if you later qualify it with "comparatively speaking, blah blah blah..."
I am sorta thinking that these automatically defending Biden types are actually working against Biden and for Trump.. (wanting Biden to be the Nominee , to make it easier to take him down)
But yes, nor only how do you discuss it, but how do you get the message TO BIDEN, to rouse him from his egotistical slumber and go "wow, if the stakes are as high as I claim, with democracy around the world and right here at stake, then WTF am I doing running, i am too Tired to do another 4 years and i need to see how if not My age, then My approval ratings are going to put the Democratic Ticket in Deep Peril."
Makes me wonder if it's not in as much trouble as he claims, maybe he knows something we don't know?
Other times I think " maybe the establishment needs a republican to win right now to offset their civil war chants; Or they know that from here on out, with Quality Candidates, that Democrat's will win most elections due to the young vote or something, and so need to give the Republicans one more term.
Or, maybe the thinking is that with Trump in the White House again, the country will go off the rails so much and the Republicans party will die its final death, after years of Attempts by the Powers That Be to help that along , via Trump and his particularly poisonous method that he uses on the Republican Party.
I mean , over the last 6 years I've often thought to myself" Trump is TOO perfect at Undoing the Tenants of the Republican Party.. Too perfect at it.
What i am saying is that i have over the last number of years I've detected a possibly concerted effort to Undermine first The Tea Party and then Undermine the Republican Party by calling to it's fold all manner of Nazi/Anti-government/Misogynistic/Authoritarian/mean, nasty and every other Anti " American strain, and cultivating it with precision and aplomb.
Like "they" are trying their hardest to cultivate all this evilness, to as quick as possible transform the GOP into this poisonous Bomb, made and gathered to Explode it and the Republican Party.
Maybe some secret computer model predicted that if left to our own devices, we would fall victim to a mood that allowed Authorizationism to flourish. And maybe the model predicted that it would be very bad. Like Actually bad.
Trump might be faking it, on the promise that he can gather as much money through fundraising as he can, and enrichment of his family, in exchange for Playing the Autocrat.
Because trump has always seemed to me to be a bumbling sad attempt at an Autocrat.
Where he had opportunities to do evil, it almost seemed staged
Like his calling Georgias SEC of State and asking for "I need, uh, 11,780 votes, one more than we needed" it sounds so staged to me (when i am entertaining these things as reality, which isn't all the time. )
Like he is dispassionately reading the number from a prepared notes ' things to mention that will ensure that you will get into Trouble with the Georgia State Prosecutors$
Like it seems like he is trying to Hit all the various things that could come back to bite him, because that's exactly what he wants, in his role as the Destroyer of the Republican Party. I call him "The Wronger of the Right" , basically employed to systematically destroy the Republican Party
I know its a crazy theory, and i only entertain it part time, while also entertaining other ideas...
But back in 2016 when Salman Rushdie said on Live TV that Trump was a Democratic Plant, i too was thinking that. But we were assuming that he was meant to get the Nomination but lose to Cruz or something
Imagine if Cruz had won, and trump still had stoked division from the outside, i think that Cruz or like we have now, Desantis, would end up taking away our liberties and what not.. maybe not all right now, but it could be the slow burn towards the Crisis that the Hypothetical Computer Program predicted..
Or, maybe the thinking is that with Trump in the White House again, the country will go off the rails so much and the Republicans party will die its final death, after years of Attempts by the Powers That Be to help that along , via Trump and his particularly poisonous method that he uses on the Republican Party.
I mean , over the last 6 years I've often thought to myself" Trump is TOO perfect at Undoing the Tenants of the Republican Party.. Too perfect at it.
What i am saying is that i have over the last number of years detected the outline of what is a possibly concerted effort to Undermine first The Tea Party and then Undermine the Republican Party by calling to it's fold all manner of Nazi/Anti-government/Misogynistic/Authoritarian/mean, nasty and every other Anti " American strain, and cultivating it with precision and aplomb.
Like "they" are trying their hardest to cultivate all this evilness, to as quick as possible transform the GOP into this poisonous Bomb, made and gathered to Explode it and the Republican Party.
Maybe some secret computer model predicted that if left to our own devices, we would fall victim to a mood that allowed Authorizationism to flourish. And maybe the model predicted that it would be very bad. Like Actually bad.
Trump might be faking it, on the promise that he can gather as much money through fundraising as he can, and enrichment of his family, in exchange for Playing the Autocrat.
Because trump has always seemed to me to be a bumbling sad attempt at an Autocrat.
Where he had opportunities to do evil, it almost seemed staged
Like his calling Georgias SEC of State and asking for "I need, uh, 11,780 votes, one more than we needed" it sounds so staged to me (when i am entertaining these things as reality, which isn't all the time. )
Like he is dispassionately reading the number from a prepared notes ' things to mention that will ensure that you will get into Trouble with the Georgia State Prosecutors$
Like it seems like he is trying to Hit all the various things that could come back to bite him, because that's exactly what he wants, in his role as the Destroyer of the Republican Party. I call him "The Wronger of the Right" , basically employed to systematically destroy the Republican Party
I know its a crazy theory, and i only entertain it part time, while also entertaining other ideas...
But back in 2016 when Salman Rushdie said on Live TV that Trump was a Democratic Plant, i too was thinking that. But we were assuming that he was meant to get the Nomination but lose to Cruz or something
Imagine if Cruz had won, and trump still had stoked division from the outside, i think that Cruz or like we have now, Desantis, would end up taking away our liberties and what not.. maybe not all right now, but it could be the slow burn towards Crisis that the Computer Program saw but we didn't have a Trump to ruin party.
BUT because Trump got in, he has been able to with lightning speed and without detection do everything in his considerable power to charm the people like a snake charmer, making them go wherever he leads
When i am believing This take, i am surprised that no one is able to detect what is going on
If i was right, i obviously wouldn't be the only one who has seen This.
Perhaps they, like me, have remained quiet and not wanting to share such an outrageous conspiracy..
Or perhaps they believe in the Operation and don't want to do anything to get in the way.
I think that if someone made this a viral conspiracy theory among the right and the believed it, that they would absolutely fall apart
If Trump has been a Democratic Plant all along, working hard to destroy the Republican Party and get all the would be Nazis and such to congregate on X (it's why Musk bought it, so he could finally be allowed to help the Great Work, the Cause) and have them all digitally registered as "potentially concerning" people to the FBI or whatever Org runs this thing, it wouldn't surprise me at all.
Out of ALL THE ABOVE insanity, there could be something in it that you have always had a question about.
It's okay if not...
So, anyway, so yeah, in this Scenario, where Joe seems poised to hand over the WH, im wondering if the Program (or the Programmers) thought that Trump would be best served WITH ONE LAST HURRAH, TAKING THE REPUBLICAN PARTY EVEN CLOSER TO THE EDGE OF TREASON.
And maybe upon finally doing something outrageous, Trump Dies AND THEN THEY RELEASE THE INFORMATION ABOUT TRUMP BEING A DEMOCRATIC PLANT, AND ALL THE FOLLOWERS WILL GO CRAZY, AMONGST THEMSELVES, AND EVENTUALLY LOSE INTEREST IN VOTING IN ENOUGH NUMBERS FOR THE NEAR FUTURE.
This would solve the Dillema my theory has which is " well once you cultivate all these Republicans to their side, what do they do? Like how are they eventually neutralized
Maybe the answer to that problem is that they are shown some sort of Proof they would accept that shows Trump being a step by step operation this whole time.
I bet that the Military would need to be called at first, due to the Rage that maga Will go though. But then after everything has settled, the right wouldn't know who it can trust and would likely cease participating in the elections.
TFG is most definitely mentally impaired and absolutely morally unfit for the office of president.
The difference is Trump has a cult that creates pictures of him sporting a body like 1980's Arnold Schwarzenegger. They would vote for Trump if he was nothing more than a brain in a jar with a ticket-tape LED screen scrolling MAGA!
Biden has to deal with a coalition that is not dedicated to voting for him no matter what. He has to deal with his perceptions in the voting public. He doesn't have the floor that Trump does and he doesn't have the propaganda machine Trump does.
So in our two-choice system, the choice between a visibly aged and declining Biden and Trump, enough people might vote against Biden or just not vote at all, to put Trump back in the White House.
We could remove every single bad actor in republican politics right now and it wouldn't change the dynamics because these are the people that the GOP base wants and votes for.
This is true but the majority of voters don't pay much attention to the particulars. This is why bumper sticker slogans are so effective and why actual policy doesn't have to match the rhetoric.
Agreed. I think every penny, every project, of Biden's term should have signs posted saying "Built By Bidenomics"!!! He needs his name out there connected to the positive. (I have come to loathe "close advisors" as self-interested but clueless about America.)
He does? I've been watching him for years, and he's always been awkward and not great at public speaking. What incidents make you think he's losing a step?
I agree with you. I don't think that Biden looks nor acts as 118 old. He looks pretty good for his age plus he keeps himself in shape. I don't think that the majority has written him off. People may mention his age, but they don't say that they would not vote for him. About the economy. I saw a poll on Axios where people were asked how they were doing financially and about 68% said that they were fine. When asked about the economy in general only about 38% said it was fine. Why this discrepancy? I think it is due to the MSM media that needs bad news to get an audience. And we democrats are not ostriches with our heads in the sand. We know that Biden is old, we just don't need it repeated over and over. You are right also Sherm, Trump is way worse in physical and mental health. If he wins the nomination we will have two old men, Biden, competent, a healthy body and a clear mind against a deranged, sociopath wannabe dictator and obese also. We democrats will vote for Biden and likely many independents. It is not that we have two choose between two evils, Biden is not evil, Trump is. It is sad to see people concentrating on Biden's age without no acknowledgement of his accomplishments and his administration. He is not an island either, it is teamwork or if something happened to him, the team would continue its great job. I don't have any problem whatsoever with Biden. I do have nightmares about Trump.
As JVL says, the problem is with the Voters! Educated / uneducated / supposedly independent... that grab onto his age as a detriment. Because partly he speaks softly, and sometimes slowly. Trump seems to run around like a maniac and spews his words out. I think the fact that he makes little sense seems not to matter to many. Biden makes sense with quiet words, Trumps spews nonsense loudly. People just hear the loud, spoken quickly, and he seems younger by far compared to Biden. Now, these are for the most part, I think, the folks that do not pay attention to the substance of politics as we do here in our little club. Which is sad. But a reality which has always been, for the most part.
Maybe we need an old fashioned smokey backroom meeting before or during the convention???How about Whitmer/Sherrod Brown? He is an awesome dude with a great workingman record.
I saw the discrepancy too! And they are calling it something (term escapes me now), but essentially as you said people say they’re doing great but everyone else is suffering terribly. THAT is what needs to be dealt with, the cognitive dissonance of what is actually happening and what they think is happening.
TFG is old, FAT, unhealthy, unfit, semiconscious, inarticulate, vengeful and violent.
Biden is old, healthy, fit, mostly conscious despite his lisp, often articulate, clever as a fox, incredibly experienced in foreign policy and more democratic than not.
But that is NOT the MEDIA or PR view being propounded here. We should watch more EU TV news as they seem much more clear-eyed and just as worried about us.
I had half thought Biden would be a four year place holder but his ego got the better of him and I think he doesn't realize how scary his age is, not because he is incompetent but because his age is being used as a hammer to vote him out.
and I think he doesn't realize how scary his age is, not because he is incompetent but because his age is being used as a hammer to vote him out."
This
Exactly this.
He is seemingly protected from himself by his staff. I wonder if he ACTUALLY believes that he is the best for this frightening moment. Part of me thinks he is simply doing everyone a favor by pretending to run. A favor, by avoiding the meltdown that is supposedly going to happen in the Democratic Party if they have to go At it amongst themselves.
If he is i hope he gives up his running sooner than later.
But part of me Also sees this as Biden as a man insulated from Reality, from his mistakes and from the perception of just how badly he looks at times. He's not being done any favors by his staff for protecting him: they are doing exactly what was claimed happened in Trump's years: that no one wanted to and ever did give him any news he didn't want to hear.
With Biden, I think it's only been a partial replay of that, but entirely around his own performance and weaknesses
Because how can i reconcile the Biden who believed that America was at Risk and needed to be defended at all costs, and Biden who is blinded to his own issues (maybe) and too deep a victim of his handling to see how much of a risk the public see him as.
Unfortunately, your reply is buried under sub-threads. The original comment, "Biden is three years older than Trump chronologically, but probably at least a decade younger than Trump physically and cognitively." Is pure, and sad, fantasy. No one complains or even raises Trump's age, and he is projected with vigor in his golf swings. True or not, those are the perceptions, and voters go on perception. Age, the cost of gasoline and bread, the neer-do-well son, the drumbeat of insults -- and third, fourth and fifth party candidates. The handwriting is on the wall. Oh, for the days of negotiated candidates.
Not at all with the same kind of consistency, noise and hammer-pounding constantly 24/7!!!!!!! Only as side comments from Democrats. Not a media pounding like they are doing to Biden.
This, precisely. The double standard re candidate age has to stop. Biden is three years older than Trump chronologically, but probably at least a decade younger than Trump physically and cognitively.
I think Kamala is the wrong person for the next in line to be President. Just because she clicks two boxes doesn't make her experienced. I'd much prefer a more solid VP like Witmer. I voted for Kamala for Senator and I was disappointed they picked her for VP slot.
You may be right, but she's a tough cookie and a Midwesterner. She might have a chance. They seem to be okay with Haley and she both a woman and non white.
Maybe. But they could have her take over for Feinstein who is completely out of it. She could say she wants to make sure they can protect the Democratic seat. Haley is advertising that she's not running against Biden, she is running against Harris. That's bad. Because all of the good things people see in Biden, Harris is lacking.
Kamala Harris' race and gender is absolutely a factor for her opponents on the right. Which is why I have a hard time imagining that a non-white person could ever be on a GOP presidential ticket.
Every President we elect has a Vice President to step in and serve out their term. Any President could die unexpectedly while in office. Kamala would do a better job than anyone Trump could bring to the table (pretty sure he’s gonna get the GOP nomination). That you can count on. Chill out, people.
Welll said. Remember the Tea Party? Remember birtherism? Remember who relentlessly pushed birtherism? Since the Equal Rights Act the Democrats have never won the white vote.
It is not very hard: Trump alone understood the racism of the GOP's base and very effectively, I would say brilliantly, seized ownership of it. He regards this, probably correctly, as the cleverest thing he has ever done, and he is not letting go.
As for misogony, two words only need be said: Hilary Clinton.
Charlie has seized on Nicky Hailey’s new message of “Biden is so old, think of the danger of President Kamala Harris”. This position elides two important elements: a) Trump is only a couple years younger, and b) holy shit, think about who he’s going to pick for VP. You think you don’t like VP Harris? Try having VP Lake or Taylor-Green only a heartbeat away.
Carson, you made the most sensible point I've yet seen in regard to all the endless Bulwark discussions about Kamala Harris needing to be replaced. I swear they started the day after the inauguration!
There has been a constant repeat of the lazy media narrative surrounding Biden's age, while barely mentioning that Trump is almost the same age and his rants are like those of a dementia patient. Then there is the Stoddard article that is wishful speculation about how the Democrats should somehow replace Biden and Harris with a unicorn ticket of Whitmer-Warnock. None of this is helpful at all.
I agree, Kamala is very smart, plus she is not there as a decorative figure, she knows well about policies and goals of this administration, plus she is not a wallflower. But she is a woman and black and misogynism and racism are still rampant. I don't worry at all about Kamala becoming President. She will be great!! It is amazing that in this country she is the first VP. In Costa Rica, for example, there was a female president and VPs are mostly women. Now, there is a black woman VP even when the majority of the population of Costa Rica is not black. Not white but caffe latte:). I know of a democrat who did not vote on 2016 because it was Hillary the candidate. Not only that but he believed all the awful things they were saying about her. I don't know why this country is considered "developed" while Costa Rica is "underdeveloped" Maybe developed means more guns and plutocracy not democracy. In 1948, Costa Rica got rid of the army. Tourism has flourished because costaricans are fiercely protective of its nature diversity, forests, birds, wild animals, etc. And since 1949 there is Universal Health Care. No, it is not perfect. People go to the polls every four years and their vote counts, no Electoral College. Sorry, I digressed. I wanted to point out that I don't consider the USA developed as far as humanism and equality are concerned. Even if the Declaration of Independence mentioned that we are all created equal. I don't have any qualms about Kamala being President!!!
Totally agree. I have friends who have told me specifically they would vote for Biden but they’re worried about his age because then Kamala would be president and they can’t deal with that. when I mention Nixon and Ford they’re like yeah but. I am not sure Biden will go the distance but talking about it endlessly with no options for what could be done otherwise is a waste of time. I know Charlie’s trying to convince us, of what I’m not sure. We all know Joe is old, probably past his prime but he is the incumbent and if he wants to run, that’s the way it works, after all the other party doesn’t even have an incumbent that runs every time and will for the future until wins or dies. If there are any solutions to the Biden problem, other than ditching him, I’d love to hear them. I do think that the Democrats (us) do a terrible job of messaging but that is nothing new and certainly is not because of Biden. Charlie, write secret letters signed with a Democrat’s name and tell them what they should be doing. Same for Mike Murphy.
I don't think I can identify a single US Presidential election where the VP changed the result. Kennedy wins without Texas. In fact, Clair Engle as VP wins California for Kennedy.
Sorry Ginny,I meant they’re telling us. I’m fine with Harris. Your comment was very good. I’m continuously puzzeled by the bw hand wringing on Harris. I think you make an excellent observation. Seems some of this exists on the bw also,sad to say. Don’t forget all these bw people are still conservatives at heart,evenif I have a fondness for JV and Tim.❤️
And properly so. The Vice President has an image problem and both she and Biden would benefit from getting her out in positive public situations more often. She appears to be a capable retail politician and that is the strength of the Democratic party.
No, I didn't care much for her coming out of the primaries and would have preferred an alternative but, she's what we've got, she hasn't done anything terribly wrong and there's no overwhelming reason to remove her from the ticket.
It’s 100% about the possibility of having a black woman in the WH, even at TB. Nobody ever pins down why she couldn’t step in if necessary and do just fine with a Chief of Staff and a cabinet and aides and briefing books. It’s just no some amorphous code that we are all supposed to agree with.
They all disliked Obama, although nobody spells out why, exactly.
As Mitch McConnell said, they let us have a black president; what more do we want?
Obama was extremely brilliant and had charisma. Harris is no Obama. I voted for her for Senate and I was eager to see her evolve in that role. But not as VP and never as Presidrnt. She would lose in a landslide. Witmer would be an excellent VP.
Let’s look instead at 2028. Joe is done and the field is wide open. Kamala has no advantage. Democratic VPs don’t automatically ascend. The same is true of 2024.
I don’t have much use for AB. She doesn’t have an impressive enough record of calling balls and strikes to keep my attention. She’s also the Angel of Death.
Warnock probably cannot get elected, not because he’s black but because he’s single. We don’t elect single men. Married men poll as more stable and trustworthy; I don’t make the rules. We don’t elect gay men either but I feel pretty sure Pete will be POTUS one day. It’s past time for pointless rules to fall. In the interim we don’t elect single men.
If only there had been a Republican candidate with a background comparable to Kamala Harris. Like a white dude who had been a prosecuting attorney in a major metropolitan city before moving to the national stage.
That covers Cruz and Christie at least. Although either of them a heartbeat away from the Presidency would be terrifying, except I don’t think Christie would have couped.
I don't want Christie in the Whitehouse, but not only do I agree that he wouldn't coup, I also don't think he'd be automatically bad on foreign policy or any worse than replacement value on social issues.
And yeah, there's quite a bit of damning with faint praise going on there, but Christie for all his numerous faults, doesn't terrify me the way Trump, DeSantis, and now Vivek do.
Exactly. Harris wasn't my first choice as running mate, but I see no reason why she would not be a competent president. She's as capable and qualified as many others who have had that job.
She was my choice for running mate at the time but I have been disappointed that she has not had better preparation for top spot during her VP stint, or better PR in general. I think within the party the issue is that she is not a glad-hander. IOW, Kamala has a Hilary problem. Both women are incredibly competent and experienced, particularly up against The Opposition. But not great "retail politicians" (is that the right term?) like Bill or Obama. And apparently competence isn't relevant to "electability".
Perception is Reality in politics. (Though I do recall Hillary actually WON the most VOTES in face of lots of thumbs on the scale from Putin to Comey.)
And Democrats always let the GOP frame the message, which is fatal. And it's happening again, with Biden's age. (Which I do worry about! He seems exhausted much of the time. He is too old to survive the aging in office of truly responsible presidents like everyone but TFG.)
As thankful as I am for Biden/Harris, I could get behind Whitmer/Warlock. But they have young children. And it is a dangerous game these days.
From what I've heard, Kamala Harris and Hilary Clinton are better with small groups and interactions on a personal basis than they are with speeches and media interviews. They aren't politically gifted at the same level as Gretchen Whitmer and Raphael Warnock. Or for that matter Gavin Newsome, Barack Obama, Bill Clinton or Ronald Reagan. The same could probably be said for most politicians, Biden included. Though according to commentary I've heard Kamala can do well in debates if she is properly coached.
The Biden administration definitely needs to up its game with messaging and with pushing back against this constant drumbeat about Biden's age, Hunter's travails, and how Biden was somehow responsible for inflation.
Which is worse, wearing a tan suit or promoting the spread of a deadly virus and trying to overthrow the results of an election? Apparently for Republicans, wearing a tan suit.
Haley is out there scaring up the people with the vote for Biden would produce a President Harris. She's kicked Joe into the grave while he's still living.
But this argument could backfire - she is also a woman, and one of color. So I don't get it.
14 months out from the 2020 election how many people had Joe as their top choice? Not me, I wrote to the guy urging him not to run 'for the good of the country.' Also, Nikki Haley, Tim Scott on R's ticket and it's 'not even close,' a 'sure thing?'
He was my top choice for 2016, too. In fact the Quinnipiac Poll called me in September 2015 and asked me whom I preferred for President. Without hesitation I said Biden. I think he would have beaten Trump in 2016 and we would have been spared the rise of fascism.
He was my choice after Pete. He has more experience than the rest of the contenders did collectively. I just loved Pete the best. When he asked us to throw our weight behind Joe, we did.
And contrary (apparently) to everybody at TB, I knew exactly how old Joe was when I voted for him and how old he’d be now and I also know how old he’ll be at the end of his second term. Constantly reminding me as though I’m impaired isn’t going to make me less likely to vote for him.
Plus Biden actually reads his briefing books and always has. He was famous for using his Amtrak commute between Wilmington and DC to do all of his policy reading. Biden is effective because he has the self-awareness to know he's not the smartest guy so he does his homework and makes up for it with being prepared.
Sharp as a tack and every bit as good a public speaker as he was fifty years ago. Which is to say, once a lousy public speaker, always a lousy public speaker. That God that he was from a small state that didn't have its own television station! We need him now more than ever.
Charlie, it's not that we want you to stop talking about Biden's age. It's that by spending all this time taking about it, and no mention at all about how Donald Trump is only two years younger, morbidly obese, spouting word salad with a family history of dementia, you are helping to further the narrative you're worried about. Joe Biden does not look especially bad for someone of his age. Judged by that standard, he's pretty spry, especially in comparison to his opponent. The Trump campaign wants everyone to consider Biden's age in a vacuum, and you're doing exactly that.
I agree 100%
Exactly. I don't think that anyone is saying that the media should never mention the fact that Biden is 80 years old. The problem is that the 'liberal' mainstream media obsessively repeats tired and lazy talking points about Biden's age, while ignoring the fact that Trump is only 4 years younger. And if they're not bringing up Biden's age they're ruminating over Hunter's issues or inflation.
As a result of this constant drumbeat, when many if not most people think of Biden they associate him with his octogenarian status, Hunter's travails, and high inflation. Like they associated Hilary Clinton with the emails and Benghazi. Never mind that Biden is definitely in better shape that Trump. Or that Hunter Biden doesn't hold elected office and even Jim Jordan's House committee hasn't been able to find anything that connects the elder Biden to his son's business dealings. And inflation was last year's news.
You know Mr. Sykes did something similar doing thr WI senatorial race...overly harping on Barnes shortcomings as a sign he (or dems) shouldn't have voted for him but Johnson's issues as just general problems any R faces. Like when Johnson put out those ads making Barnes darker...Mr. Sykes mentioned it as being bad but yet what the base wanted. He seems capable of calling out behavior but never to the point of withdrawing support.
In the end, Mr. Skyes maybe Never Trump, but he is still also apparently "Never Left". The idea that both sides deserve criticism is fair. Yet his criticism seems to be from the viewpoint of someone who wants so the left be more like the right used to be, not someone who wants to see the left succeed. He wants so badly for the Dems who will run people who will appeal to the old pre MAGA base...but as many have said, trying to co opt the Dem party is well...off-putting.
I am starting to want to read Bulwark just for JVL and the guest writers.....
I was really disappointed by Charlie's criticism of Barnes. It gave anti-Trump conservatives cover to vote for Johnson. And who was the greater threat to democracy? Barnes, or Johnson who tried to have fake Electoral College ballots turned in to be counted. (I know he tried to blame his staff for that, but if you believe anyone on his staff would have done that without his direction, or at least knowledge and approval, then I have got a bridge you might like.
I couldn’t like this enough. It was exactly what I planned to say when I clicked the link to comment.
This was discussed fully in the podcast yesterday. Biden simply looks and sounds older. It's all about perception. Murphy had some excellent advice on how to attempt to address this.
I'm a Democrat and know that Biden is absolutely up to the job as President. But this is about appearances, nothing rational. Even though Trump is close to Biden's age, Trump has a quickness and fire (with an extra topping of malice, anger and hatred) that Biden does not have. Biden seems low energy. He is not silver-tongued, never has been, but now with his decreased outward energy level, it makes things worse. Yeah, Trump has lost animation in his voice but he's still got a twinkle in his eye, a quick (if stupid) reaction to whatever comes at him. He can still bullshit fluently. Better than Biden. It's sad but true.
Trump is a complete loud mouth idiot when he talks. Biden is very quick on his feet. Do remember the SOTU where he was energized by the heckling of the bratty Republicans. He was able to get them to agree, on national TV, to not cut Social Security! When they realized what he had done, he laughed. He was amazing.
He knows how to wield power and talk to members of Congress. And yes, he did have a quick and strategically effect reaction at SOTU. He's also a hell of a negotiator, besting McCarthy in the debt ceiling talks. But our country's electoral judgment is increasingly less about content and more about affect and showmanship. And, I hate to say it, Biden *appears* kind of fragile or frail. Not in content but in visual and audio impression. Trump may be unhealthy, sloppy, and whiny, but nobody would call him frail (although he's emotionally and psychologically fragile as glass)
To me looks like an obese slob.
That's true, and its' all about perception. Trump is a showman, a master at manipulating the media, dominating the stage, and getting attention. He is also always on the attack and projects an animus, a primal rage, and an unencumbered sarcasm (complete with juvenile nicknames) that makes literally anyone else seem 'low energy' and weak by comparison.
I think you've really put your finger on it!
Thanks!
I think you are conflating being loud and screaming malice with being fluent and articulate. I have never ever heard TFG actually deliver a thoughtful articulate statement. But I take your point.
Part of the reason people think that if Trump is because the media constantly edits his word salad into quotes without ever noting that they're doing it. It makes his statements look orders of magnitude more reasonable and coherent than they actually are.
Good point.
It doesn’t matter that Trump’s old too. What matters is that the majority thinks Biden is too old.
This.
Perception is Reality in Politics.
This is very much like the liberal "Don't give Trump attention and he'll go away" belief.
By not talking about Biden's age, maybe you will feel comforted that it's not an issue, but a not insignificant portion of the voting public very much believes that it is an issue.
Many people voted for Biden over Trump to get Trump out of the White House, believing (falsely it seems) that both men would not be back in 2024 because of their age. Unfortunately both are back and age IS an issue, this time for Biden doubly so because he's the incumbent.
Again, it's not "don't talk about Biden's age." It's "Charlie is uncritically accepting the framing of the Trump campaign as the basis of his argument." By starting with "Biden is decrepit," you reinforce the idea that somehow Trump isn't in the exact same position, even if you later qualify it with "comparatively speaking, blah blah blah..."
So, how do you discuss the elephant in the polling booth without addressing the fact that Joe Biden *IS* aging and *DOES* appear to be losing a step?
Exactly. You proved the point
I am sorta thinking that these automatically defending Biden types are actually working against Biden and for Trump.. (wanting Biden to be the Nominee , to make it easier to take him down)
But yes, nor only how do you discuss it, but how do you get the message TO BIDEN, to rouse him from his egotistical slumber and go "wow, if the stakes are as high as I claim, with democracy around the world and right here at stake, then WTF am I doing running, i am too Tired to do another 4 years and i need to see how if not My age, then My approval ratings are going to put the Democratic Ticket in Deep Peril."
Makes me wonder if it's not in as much trouble as he claims, maybe he knows something we don't know?
Other times I think " maybe the establishment needs a republican to win right now to offset their civil war chants; Or they know that from here on out, with Quality Candidates, that Democrat's will win most elections due to the young vote or something, and so need to give the Republicans one more term.
Or, maybe the thinking is that with Trump in the White House again, the country will go off the rails so much and the Republicans party will die its final death, after years of Attempts by the Powers That Be to help that along , via Trump and his particularly poisonous method that he uses on the Republican Party.
I mean , over the last 6 years I've often thought to myself" Trump is TOO perfect at Undoing the Tenants of the Republican Party.. Too perfect at it.
What i am saying is that i have over the last number of years I've detected a possibly concerted effort to Undermine first The Tea Party and then Undermine the Republican Party by calling to it's fold all manner of Nazi/Anti-government/Misogynistic/Authoritarian/mean, nasty and every other Anti " American strain, and cultivating it with precision and aplomb.
Like "they" are trying their hardest to cultivate all this evilness, to as quick as possible transform the GOP into this poisonous Bomb, made and gathered to Explode it and the Republican Party.
Maybe some secret computer model predicted that if left to our own devices, we would fall victim to a mood that allowed Authorizationism to flourish. And maybe the model predicted that it would be very bad. Like Actually bad.
Trump might be faking it, on the promise that he can gather as much money through fundraising as he can, and enrichment of his family, in exchange for Playing the Autocrat.
Because trump has always seemed to me to be a bumbling sad attempt at an Autocrat.
Where he had opportunities to do evil, it almost seemed staged
Like his calling Georgias SEC of State and asking for "I need, uh, 11,780 votes, one more than we needed" it sounds so staged to me (when i am entertaining these things as reality, which isn't all the time. )
Like he is dispassionately reading the number from a prepared notes ' things to mention that will ensure that you will get into Trouble with the Georgia State Prosecutors$
Like it seems like he is trying to Hit all the various things that could come back to bite him, because that's exactly what he wants, in his role as the Destroyer of the Republican Party. I call him "The Wronger of the Right" , basically employed to systematically destroy the Republican Party
I know its a crazy theory, and i only entertain it part time, while also entertaining other ideas...
But back in 2016 when Salman Rushdie said on Live TV that Trump was a Democratic Plant, i too was thinking that. But we were assuming that he was meant to get the Nomination but lose to Cruz or something
Imagine if Cruz had won, and trump still had stoked division from the outside, i think that Cruz or like we have now, Desantis, would end up taking away our liberties and what not.. maybe not all right now, but it could be the slow burn towards the Crisis that the Hypothetical Computer Program predicted..
Or, maybe the thinking is that with Trump in the White House again, the country will go off the rails so much and the Republicans party will die its final death, after years of Attempts by the Powers That Be to help that along , via Trump and his particularly poisonous method that he uses on the Republican Party.
I mean , over the last 6 years I've often thought to myself" Trump is TOO perfect at Undoing the Tenants of the Republican Party.. Too perfect at it.
What i am saying is that i have over the last number of years detected the outline of what is a possibly concerted effort to Undermine first The Tea Party and then Undermine the Republican Party by calling to it's fold all manner of Nazi/Anti-government/Misogynistic/Authoritarian/mean, nasty and every other Anti " American strain, and cultivating it with precision and aplomb.
Like "they" are trying their hardest to cultivate all this evilness, to as quick as possible transform the GOP into this poisonous Bomb, made and gathered to Explode it and the Republican Party.
Maybe some secret computer model predicted that if left to our own devices, we would fall victim to a mood that allowed Authorizationism to flourish. And maybe the model predicted that it would be very bad. Like Actually bad.
Trump might be faking it, on the promise that he can gather as much money through fundraising as he can, and enrichment of his family, in exchange for Playing the Autocrat.
Because trump has always seemed to me to be a bumbling sad attempt at an Autocrat.
Where he had opportunities to do evil, it almost seemed staged
Like his calling Georgias SEC of State and asking for "I need, uh, 11,780 votes, one more than we needed" it sounds so staged to me (when i am entertaining these things as reality, which isn't all the time. )
Like he is dispassionately reading the number from a prepared notes ' things to mention that will ensure that you will get into Trouble with the Georgia State Prosecutors$
Like it seems like he is trying to Hit all the various things that could come back to bite him, because that's exactly what he wants, in his role as the Destroyer of the Republican Party. I call him "The Wronger of the Right" , basically employed to systematically destroy the Republican Party
I know its a crazy theory, and i only entertain it part time, while also entertaining other ideas...
But back in 2016 when Salman Rushdie said on Live TV that Trump was a Democratic Plant, i too was thinking that. But we were assuming that he was meant to get the Nomination but lose to Cruz or something
Imagine if Cruz had won, and trump still had stoked division from the outside, i think that Cruz or like we have now, Desantis, would end up taking away our liberties and what not.. maybe not all right now, but it could be the slow burn towards Crisis that the Computer Program saw but we didn't have a Trump to ruin party.
BUT because Trump got in, he has been able to with lightning speed and without detection do everything in his considerable power to charm the people like a snake charmer, making them go wherever he leads
When i am believing This take, i am surprised that no one is able to detect what is going on
If i was right, i obviously wouldn't be the only one who has seen This.
Perhaps they, like me, have remained quiet and not wanting to share such an outrageous conspiracy..
Or perhaps they believe in the Operation and don't want to do anything to get in the way.
I think that if someone made this a viral conspiracy theory among the right and the believed it, that they would absolutely fall apart
If Trump has been a Democratic Plant all along, working hard to destroy the Republican Party and get all the would be Nazis and such to congregate on X (it's why Musk bought it, so he could finally be allowed to help the Great Work, the Cause) and have them all digitally registered as "potentially concerning" people to the FBI or whatever Org runs this thing, it wouldn't surprise me at all.
Out of ALL THE ABOVE insanity, there could be something in it that you have always had a question about.
It's okay if not...
So, anyway, so yeah, in this Scenario, where Joe seems poised to hand over the WH, im wondering if the Program (or the Programmers) thought that Trump would be best served WITH ONE LAST HURRAH, TAKING THE REPUBLICAN PARTY EVEN CLOSER TO THE EDGE OF TREASON.
And maybe upon finally doing something outrageous, Trump Dies AND THEN THEY RELEASE THE INFORMATION ABOUT TRUMP BEING A DEMOCRATIC PLANT, AND ALL THE FOLLOWERS WILL GO CRAZY, AMONGST THEMSELVES, AND EVENTUALLY LOSE INTEREST IN VOTING IN ENOUGH NUMBERS FOR THE NEAR FUTURE.
This would solve the Dillema my theory has which is " well once you cultivate all these Republicans to their side, what do they do? Like how are they eventually neutralized
Maybe the answer to that problem is that they are shown some sort of Proof they would accept that shows Trump being a step by step operation this whole time.
I bet that the Military would need to be called at first, due to the Rage that maga Will go though. But then after everything has settled, the right wouldn't know who it can trust and would likely cease participating in the elections.
Maybe.
A strange tale.
What makes you think TFG isn't EXACTLY as poorly... or moreso?
TFG is most definitely mentally impaired and absolutely morally unfit for the office of president.
The difference is Trump has a cult that creates pictures of him sporting a body like 1980's Arnold Schwarzenegger. They would vote for Trump if he was nothing more than a brain in a jar with a ticket-tape LED screen scrolling MAGA!
Biden has to deal with a coalition that is not dedicated to voting for him no matter what. He has to deal with his perceptions in the voting public. He doesn't have the floor that Trump does and he doesn't have the propaganda machine Trump does.
So in our two-choice system, the choice between a visibly aged and declining Biden and Trump, enough people might vote against Biden or just not vote at all, to put Trump back in the White House.
Sadly, you're right.
It isn't better politicians we need as much as better (rational, informed, democratic) voters/citizens.
I believe this is JVL's position. https://thetriad.thebulwark.com/p/the-people-are-the-problem-part-17502
We could remove every single bad actor in republican politics right now and it wouldn't change the dynamics because these are the people that the GOP base wants and votes for.
And yet, the base is in no way big enough to elect anyone to national office, without help from other voters.
This is true but the majority of voters don't pay much attention to the particulars. This is why bumper sticker slogans are so effective and why actual policy doesn't have to match the rhetoric.
Agreed. I think every penny, every project, of Biden's term should have signs posted saying "Built By Bidenomics"!!! He needs his name out there connected to the positive. (I have come to loathe "close advisors" as self-interested but clueless about America.)
He does? I've been watching him for years, and he's always been awkward and not great at public speaking. What incidents make you think he's losing a step?
Dear Sherm:
I agree with you. I don't think that Biden looks nor acts as 118 old. He looks pretty good for his age plus he keeps himself in shape. I don't think that the majority has written him off. People may mention his age, but they don't say that they would not vote for him. About the economy. I saw a poll on Axios where people were asked how they were doing financially and about 68% said that they were fine. When asked about the economy in general only about 38% said it was fine. Why this discrepancy? I think it is due to the MSM media that needs bad news to get an audience. And we democrats are not ostriches with our heads in the sand. We know that Biden is old, we just don't need it repeated over and over. You are right also Sherm, Trump is way worse in physical and mental health. If he wins the nomination we will have two old men, Biden, competent, a healthy body and a clear mind against a deranged, sociopath wannabe dictator and obese also. We democrats will vote for Biden and likely many independents. It is not that we have two choose between two evils, Biden is not evil, Trump is. It is sad to see people concentrating on Biden's age without no acknowledgement of his accomplishments and his administration. He is not an island either, it is teamwork or if something happened to him, the team would continue its great job. I don't have any problem whatsoever with Biden. I do have nightmares about Trump.
As JVL says, the problem is with the Voters! Educated / uneducated / supposedly independent... that grab onto his age as a detriment. Because partly he speaks softly, and sometimes slowly. Trump seems to run around like a maniac and spews his words out. I think the fact that he makes little sense seems not to matter to many. Biden makes sense with quiet words, Trumps spews nonsense loudly. People just hear the loud, spoken quickly, and he seems younger by far compared to Biden. Now, these are for the most part, I think, the folks that do not pay attention to the substance of politics as we do here in our little club. Which is sad. But a reality which has always been, for the most part.
Maybe we need an old fashioned smokey backroom meeting before or during the convention???How about Whitmer/Sherrod Brown? He is an awesome dude with a great workingman record.
Though I would not like losing him as a senator..
Sadly, the way Ohio is going, you may lose him regardless in 2024. He would make a great candidate for Pres, though, if only he wanted it.
I saw the discrepancy too! And they are calling it something (term escapes me now), but essentially as you said people say they’re doing great but everyone else is suffering terribly. THAT is what needs to be dealt with, the cognitive dissonance of what is actually happening and what they think is happening.
You are right, it is part of disinformation by Republicans mainly and MSM.
3.5 years younger but close enough to be just as negligible. Unfortunately Trump voters have a double standard for everything.
TFG is old, FAT, unhealthy, unfit, semiconscious, inarticulate, vengeful and violent.
Biden is old, healthy, fit, mostly conscious despite his lisp, often articulate, clever as a fox, incredibly experienced in foreign policy and more democratic than not.
But that is NOT the MEDIA or PR view being propounded here. We should watch more EU TV news as they seem much more clear-eyed and just as worried about us.
I had half thought Biden would be a four year place holder but his ego got the better of him and I think he doesn't realize how scary his age is, not because he is incompetent but because his age is being used as a hammer to vote him out.
and I think he doesn't realize how scary his age is, not because he is incompetent but because his age is being used as a hammer to vote him out."
This
Exactly this.
He is seemingly protected from himself by his staff. I wonder if he ACTUALLY believes that he is the best for this frightening moment. Part of me thinks he is simply doing everyone a favor by pretending to run. A favor, by avoiding the meltdown that is supposedly going to happen in the Democratic Party if they have to go At it amongst themselves.
If he is i hope he gives up his running sooner than later.
But part of me Also sees this as Biden as a man insulated from Reality, from his mistakes and from the perception of just how badly he looks at times. He's not being done any favors by his staff for protecting him: they are doing exactly what was claimed happened in Trump's years: that no one wanted to and ever did give him any news he didn't want to hear.
With Biden, I think it's only been a partial replay of that, but entirely around his own performance and weaknesses
Because how can i reconcile the Biden who believed that America was at Risk and needed to be defended at all costs, and Biden who is blinded to his own issues (maybe) and too deep a victim of his handling to see how much of a risk the public see him as.
Unfortunately, your reply is buried under sub-threads. The original comment, "Biden is three years older than Trump chronologically, but probably at least a decade younger than Trump physically and cognitively." Is pure, and sad, fantasy. No one complains or even raises Trump's age, and he is projected with vigor in his golf swings. True or not, those are the perceptions, and voters go on perception. Age, the cost of gasoline and bread, the neer-do-well son, the drumbeat of insults -- and third, fourth and fifth party candidates. The handwriting is on the wall. Oh, for the days of negotiated candidates.
Spot on Sherm!
Are you seriously implying that Trump’s weight, diet, cognition, etc haven’t been constant commentary fodder for like eight years?
Not his cognition or age. No, it hasn’t, but it should be.
Not at all with the same kind of consistency, noise and hammer-pounding constantly 24/7!!!!!!! Only as side comments from Democrats. Not a media pounding like they are doing to Biden.
This, precisely. The double standard re candidate age has to stop. Biden is three years older than Trump chronologically, but probably at least a decade younger than Trump physically and cognitively.
I think Kamala is the wrong person for the next in line to be President. Just because she clicks two boxes doesn't make her experienced. I'd much prefer a more solid VP like Witmer. I voted for Kamala for Senator and I was disappointed they picked her for VP slot.
You may be right, but she's a tough cookie and a Midwesterner. She might have a chance. They seem to be okay with Haley and she both a woman and non white.
Maybe. But they could have her take over for Feinstein who is completely out of it. She could say she wants to make sure they can protect the Democratic seat. Haley is advertising that she's not running against Biden, she is running against Harris. That's bad. Because all of the good things people see in Biden, Harris is lacking.
Kamala Harris' race and gender is absolutely a factor for her opponents on the right. Which is why I have a hard time imagining that a non-white person could ever be on a GOP presidential ticket.
It's the result of millions of people being brainwashed by a very effective right wing propaganda machine.
Every President we elect has a Vice President to step in and serve out their term. Any President could die unexpectedly while in office. Kamala would do a better job than anyone Trump could bring to the table (pretty sure he’s gonna get the GOP nomination). That you can count on. Chill out, people.
Welll said. Remember the Tea Party? Remember birtherism? Remember who relentlessly pushed birtherism? Since the Equal Rights Act the Democrats have never won the white vote.
It is not very hard: Trump alone understood the racism of the GOP's base and very effectively, I would say brilliantly, seized ownership of it. He regards this, probably correctly, as the cleverest thing he has ever done, and he is not letting go.
As for misogony, two words only need be said: Hilary Clinton.
As a Black person, I can tell you...at least 95% of the time it's about race.
And i 100% belive you....which means that us Black women are fighting a uphill battle
Great point!
Charlie has seized on Nicky Hailey’s new message of “Biden is so old, think of the danger of President Kamala Harris”. This position elides two important elements: a) Trump is only a couple years younger, and b) holy shit, think about who he’s going to pick for VP. You think you don’t like VP Harris? Try having VP Lake or Taylor-Green only a heartbeat away.
Carson, you made the most sensible point I've yet seen in regard to all the endless Bulwark discussions about Kamala Harris needing to be replaced. I swear they started the day after the inauguration!
Charlie’s always muttering about how Kamala Harris is a “problem”, but he never says why.
There has been a constant repeat of the lazy media narrative surrounding Biden's age, while barely mentioning that Trump is almost the same age and his rants are like those of a dementia patient. Then there is the Stoddard article that is wishful speculation about how the Democrats should somehow replace Biden and Harris with a unicorn ticket of Whitmer-Warnock. None of this is helpful at all.
I agree, Kamala is very smart, plus she is not there as a decorative figure, she knows well about policies and goals of this administration, plus she is not a wallflower. But she is a woman and black and misogynism and racism are still rampant. I don't worry at all about Kamala becoming President. She will be great!! It is amazing that in this country she is the first VP. In Costa Rica, for example, there was a female president and VPs are mostly women. Now, there is a black woman VP even when the majority of the population of Costa Rica is not black. Not white but caffe latte:). I know of a democrat who did not vote on 2016 because it was Hillary the candidate. Not only that but he believed all the awful things they were saying about her. I don't know why this country is considered "developed" while Costa Rica is "underdeveloped" Maybe developed means more guns and plutocracy not democracy. In 1948, Costa Rica got rid of the army. Tourism has flourished because costaricans are fiercely protective of its nature diversity, forests, birds, wild animals, etc. And since 1949 there is Universal Health Care. No, it is not perfect. People go to the polls every four years and their vote counts, no Electoral College. Sorry, I digressed. I wanted to point out that I don't consider the USA developed as far as humanism and equality are concerned. Even if the Declaration of Independence mentioned that we are all created equal. I don't have any qualms about Kamala being President!!!
Totally agree. I have friends who have told me specifically they would vote for Biden but they’re worried about his age because then Kamala would be president and they can’t deal with that. when I mention Nixon and Ford they’re like yeah but. I am not sure Biden will go the distance but talking about it endlessly with no options for what could be done otherwise is a waste of time. I know Charlie’s trying to convince us, of what I’m not sure. We all know Joe is old, probably past his prime but he is the incumbent and if he wants to run, that’s the way it works, after all the other party doesn’t even have an incumbent that runs every time and will for the future until wins or dies. If there are any solutions to the Biden problem, other than ditching him, I’d love to hear them. I do think that the Democrats (us) do a terrible job of messaging but that is nothing new and certainly is not because of Biden. Charlie, write secret letters signed with a Democrat’s name and tell them what they should be doing. Same for Mike Murphy.
I don't think I can identify a single US Presidential election where the VP changed the result. Kennedy wins without Texas. In fact, Clair Engle as VP wins California for Kennedy.
Sarah Palin!
McCain lost the election with his pick of Palin.
But that was then... this is now... and we know there are worse things in the Oval...
Indeed!
Steve Schmidt has talked about his regret for playing a role in her pick. The book on that campaign is fascinating.
Very thoughtful comment. You’re telling me Kamilla would be worse than any of the Republican potential candidates!?
Sorry Ginny,I meant they’re telling us. I’m fine with Harris. Your comment was very good. I’m continuously puzzeled by the bw hand wringing on Harris. I think you make an excellent observation. Seems some of this exists on the bw also,sad to say. Don’t forget all these bw people are still conservatives at heart,evenif I have a fondness for JV and Tim.❤️
And properly so. The Vice President has an image problem and both she and Biden would benefit from getting her out in positive public situations more often. She appears to be a capable retail politician and that is the strength of the Democratic party.
No, I didn't care much for her coming out of the primaries and would have preferred an alternative but, she's what we've got, she hasn't done anything terribly wrong and there's no overwhelming reason to remove her from the ticket.
That's a very low bar and Biden/Harris easily goes well over it.
It’s 100% about the possibility of having a black woman in the WH, even at TB. Nobody ever pins down why she couldn’t step in if necessary and do just fine with a Chief of Staff and a cabinet and aides and briefing books. It’s just no some amorphous code that we are all supposed to agree with.
They all disliked Obama, although nobody spells out why, exactly.
As Mitch McConnell said, they let us have a black president; what more do we want?
Obama was extremely brilliant and had charisma. Harris is no Obama. I voted for her for Senate and I was eager to see her evolve in that role. But not as VP and never as Presidrnt. She would lose in a landslide. Witmer would be an excellent VP.
In what election would there be a landslide? She’d be finishing the President’s term.
God forbid it’s necessary.
No, I meant if Biden bowed out and she ran in his place.
Oh, I see. He’s not going to.
Let’s look instead at 2028. Joe is done and the field is wide open. Kamala has no advantage. Democratic VPs don’t automatically ascend. The same is true of 2024.
I don’t have much use for AB. She doesn’t have an impressive enough record of calling balls and strikes to keep my attention. She’s also the Angel of Death.
Warnock probably cannot get elected, not because he’s black but because he’s single. We don’t elect single men. Married men poll as more stable and trustworthy; I don’t make the rules. We don’t elect gay men either but I feel pretty sure Pete will be POTUS one day. It’s past time for pointless rules to fall. In the interim we don’t elect single men.
Not sure what Tim Scott was thinking.
What do you think of MI governor Gretchen Witmer.
I think she’s awesome. I love her.
Me too.
AB Stoddard. She wrote one of her sturm und drangy rants yesterday about replacing Biden and Harris with Whitmer and Warnock.
If only there had been a Republican candidate with a background comparable to Kamala Harris. Like a white dude who had been a prosecuting attorney in a major metropolitan city before moving to the national stage.
Oh wait...
That covers Cruz and Christie at least. Although either of them a heartbeat away from the Presidency would be terrifying, except I don’t think Christie would have couped.
I don't want Christie in the Whitehouse, but not only do I agree that he wouldn't coup, I also don't think he'd be automatically bad on foreign policy or any worse than replacement value on social issues.
And yeah, there's quite a bit of damning with faint praise going on there, but Christie for all his numerous faults, doesn't terrify me the way Trump, DeSantis, and now Vivek do.
At this point I'd be okay with anyone who isn't completely insane.
Exactly. Harris wasn't my first choice as running mate, but I see no reason why she would not be a competent president. She's as capable and qualified as many others who have had that job.
She was my choice for running mate at the time but I have been disappointed that she has not had better preparation for top spot during her VP stint, or better PR in general. I think within the party the issue is that she is not a glad-hander. IOW, Kamala has a Hilary problem. Both women are incredibly competent and experienced, particularly up against The Opposition. But not great "retail politicians" (is that the right term?) like Bill or Obama. And apparently competence isn't relevant to "electability".
Perception is Reality in politics. (Though I do recall Hillary actually WON the most VOTES in face of lots of thumbs on the scale from Putin to Comey.)
And Democrats always let the GOP frame the message, which is fatal. And it's happening again, with Biden's age. (Which I do worry about! He seems exhausted much of the time. He is too old to survive the aging in office of truly responsible presidents like everyone but TFG.)
As thankful as I am for Biden/Harris, I could get behind Whitmer/Warlock. But they have young children. And it is a dangerous game these days.
From what I've heard, Kamala Harris and Hilary Clinton are better with small groups and interactions on a personal basis than they are with speeches and media interviews. They aren't politically gifted at the same level as Gretchen Whitmer and Raphael Warnock. Or for that matter Gavin Newsome, Barack Obama, Bill Clinton or Ronald Reagan. The same could probably be said for most politicians, Biden included. Though according to commentary I've heard Kamala can do well in debates if she is properly coached.
The Biden administration definitely needs to up its game with messaging and with pushing back against this constant drumbeat about Biden's age, Hunter's travails, and how Biden was somehow responsible for inflation.
And she would have the support of the Biden Administration which is helpful to remember.
"They all disliked Obama, although nobody spells out why, exactly."
Tan suit.
Democrats like him a lot. He was elected twice.
Don't forget his taste in mustard. Dijon? History's greatest monster indeed.
But they were okay with Reagan's brown suits.
He’s got a (beat) tan suit with pink shoelaces
A polka dot vest and, man oh man
He wears (beat) tan suit with pink shoelaces
And a big Panama with a purple had band.
With apologies to Dodge Stevens (1959)
Dammit, I forgot. I thought it was how his black skin clashed with their white house.
That tan suit was one of the great tragedies of our time, according to Nutbag Digest.
Which is worse, wearing a tan suit or promoting the spread of a deadly virus and trying to overthrow the results of an election? Apparently for Republicans, wearing a tan suit.
Just so I am clear, is this sarcasm?
I thought so. 😀
Just checking. Thanks for confirming.
I liked the tan suit. It was because he was Black and had his nerve.
He looked a lot better in that tan suit than any president since Kennedy has looked in any color suit
Yeah, it burned my eyes, just seeing it on TV.
Even more galling was sleeveless Michelle with those pumped-up arms. What a hussy!! (eyeroll)
Haha! Michelle inspired me to pick up weight lifting!!
(Melania inspired me to look away.)
I never want another FLOTUS that we’ve all seen naked, please and thank you.
Or near naked and posing with a big gun....
Same. Humorously, I recall an online comment shortly after Trump slouched into the White House, “FINALLY we have a First Lady with class!”
Oy vey.
Sorry, even what at VP? I’m too slow this AM to understand what you’re asking. I apologize.
Oh, no. TB is The Bulwark. That’s what I meant.
Agree.
Haley is out there scaring up the people with the vote for Biden would produce a President Harris. She's kicked Joe into the grave while he's still living.
But this argument could backfire - she is also a woman, and one of color. So I don't get it.
She has said she's running against Harris. Damn those Republicans are so great at keying in on the most potent attack stratrgy.
It isn't hard, unfortunately.
She is Indian. Harris is half Indian.
So, they’re both South Asian. What am I missing?
What you’re missing is Nikki’s hypocrisy.
That was my point.
"Nikki" can pass for white, if you don't pay too much attention.
Still a woman, though.
I mean, I wonder sometimes why these people are Republicans--haven't they figured out that it is the male white people's party?
They think they’ll be the GOP Obama.
Dream on, suckers.
She doesn’t look white enough for the GOP. If Trump ever perceives her as a threat she’s dead candidate walking.
She thinks that’s why nobody can say Nikki is a racist because she and the VP are both South Asian.
Nikki is a racist.
I figured I'd look it up since I keep hearing 2 years age difference and keep repeating it myself, but Trump is about 3.5 years younger than Biden.
True, but guess what "they" were saying about Biden 3.5 years ago?
It rhymes with "he's too schmold".
He has a cold? COVID was going around...:)
14 months out from the 2020 election how many people had Joe as their top choice? Not me, I wrote to the guy urging him not to run 'for the good of the country.' Also, Nikki Haley, Tim Scott on R's ticket and it's 'not even close,' a 'sure thing?'
"how many people had Joe as their top choice?"
Me.
He was my top choice for 2016, too. In fact the Quinnipiac Poll called me in September 2015 and asked me whom I preferred for President. Without hesitation I said Biden. I think he would have beaten Trump in 2016 and we would have been spared the rise of fascism.
Me too.
He was my choice after Pete. He has more experience than the rest of the contenders did collectively. I just loved Pete the best. When he asked us to throw our weight behind Joe, we did.
And contrary (apparently) to everybody at TB, I knew exactly how old Joe was when I voted for him and how old he’d be now and I also know how old he’ll be at the end of his second term. Constantly reminding me as though I’m impaired isn’t going to make me less likely to vote for him.
🤔 ... He's too bold?
He smells like mold?
They're certainly not going to stop saying it one year from now.
I stand corrected. Not to say I think it makes an appreciable difference, though.
Plus Biden actually reads his briefing books and always has. He was famous for using his Amtrak commute between Wilmington and DC to do all of his policy reading. Biden is effective because he has the self-awareness to know he's not the smartest guy so he does his homework and makes up for it with being prepared.
Biden is Amtrak's #1 frequent traveler ever.
Sharp as a tack and every bit as good a public speaker as he was fifty years ago. Which is to say, once a lousy public speaker, always a lousy public speaker. That God that he was from a small state that didn't have its own television station! We need him now more than ever.